I feel like he is how I was with the Bears. I'd wait for that shoe to drop. I was fine when it didn't but knew it was going to at some point. I don't know why, I give them the benefit of the doubt but I get mad at them just the same.



They are lazy and sloppy at times. Inconsistent. They are getting old and can't turn it on when they feel like it anymore. Every year teams will have a better chance at beating them for different reasons.

They change every couple years and not for the better. Less talent, less hustle, age, are all factors. They shoulda won last year but didn't.

I don't understand the Toews hate but everybody has somebody. I know what Kane does and how valuable he is but I feel like he doesn't do stuff a lot. It pisses me off and I criticize him because of it.

The Hawks still have more talent than any team in the NHL.

Enjoy this run, which I think continues for many more years.

The future holds the possibility to be great or terrible, and since it has not yet occurred it remains simultaneously both.

This simply isn't true.


Also not true. Big step back coming up for this team.

The future holds the possibility to be great or terrible, and since it has not yet occurred it remains simultaneously both.

He thinks Toews sucks, is lazy, and is a lousy leader.

Words cant describe how stupid and wrong that is.

Les Grobstein's huge hog is proof that God has a sense of humor, isn't it?

That's a weird way to phrase the question, but Minnesota, Montreal, and New York are better teams.

You're calling me out on bad predictions? What a day.

it's not wrong, per say, it's just that i think he holds him to a higher standard than most people with his name on their backs.

seriously, can't you guys see that this dude is some kind of ginormous blackhawks fan? talking up the other teams and talking down the hawks is his subconscious way of rationalizing any defeats to himself because he's trying to bury his beyond-meatballism emotion in cold hard logic with the hopes of easing the pain of the inevitable defeat he's feared since day 0 because the dude is too smart to be anything but a bit paranoid because, again, the man has indelibly high standards.

i've personally always said of sports "expect the worst and be surprised by the best and you'll never drink yourself to death" and last i checked i don't think CH is an alcoholic.

it's not wrong, per say, it's just that i think he holds him to a higher standard than most people with his name on their backs.

The future holds the possibility to be great or terrible, and since it has not yet occurred it remains simultaneously both.

Please. Ovechkin? Really? I wouldn't let him hold Toews's stick.

Les Grobstein's huge hog is proof that God has a sense of humor, isn't it?

The future holds the possibility to be great or terrible, and since it has not yet occurred it remains simultaneously both.

he could prolly score 20 goals a year without a stick if he was properly arsed.

Okay, he'd be minus 60 for the year. Talked about an overrated talented ass clown...

The future holds the possibility to be great or terrible, and since it has not yet occurred it remains simultaneously both.

Okay, he'd be minus 60 for the year. Talked about an overrated talented ass clown...

Les Grobstein's huge hog is proof that God has a sense of humor, isn't it?

isn't hockey a team sport? wouldn't -60 have something to do with the actual team on the ice? i mean yeah it's a stat for individual players but it's like saying that chris carter's 37HR/88RBIs were overall a detriment to the team because he hit .220 or whatever and overall hitting .220 does hurt the team which is X-Y record when he's out there hitting .220, but i'm the hockey ignoramus standing here all slack-jawed like "YEAH BUT HE HIT 37 HOME RUNS!"

i'm genuinely asking you here because i don't know shit about hockey. isn't +/- a team stat that's kinda tangential to the actual individual?

The future holds the possibility to be great or terrible, and since it has not yet occurred it remains simultaneously both.

you cannot play hockey all by yourself.

Les Grobstein's huge hog is proof that God has a sense of humor, isn't it?

Nobody gives a shit about +/- anymore, and even when they did, they didn't use it to assess the relative merits of all-world first-line scoring wingers. It was for defensemen and depth forwards, for whom it was more important to not get scored against than to do the scoring. It doesn't even measure penalty-killing, the time when you would most want to note that you're not getting scored against.

Yes...but there is also a point if you are going to be that guy you put the team on your back. He doesn't do that, I don't think.

Les Grobstein's huge hog is proof that God has a sense of humor, isn't it?

I don't think so. It matters.

In short, plus/minus is highly variable, there are countless factors that influence it, and more of them are outside of an individual player's control than not.

Two teammates doing everything absolutely identically to one another can see huge variance - well over 100% - in their plus/minus based on factors outside of their control like ice time, their goalie's performance, and the opposing goalie's performance. You may be wondering if players such as those in the examples above exist, and the answer is absolutely, yes. Dustin Byfuglien's goalies posted an .888 on-ice save percentage at even strength this season, Byfuglien's on-ice shooting percentage is 7.7%, and Byfuglien was playing just under 20 minutes/60 at even strength until his position change. These kinds of percentages are totally normal.

. . .

For example, an excellent power play player like Ovechkin or Byfgulien gets no credit for offense created on the PP. The Washington Capitals scored 62 power play goals with Ovechkin on the ice this past season, and allowed nine against; despite going +53 on the scoreboard, that adds up to a -9 for Ovechkin in the plus/minus column. (Byfuglien, in case you're curious, accumulated a -4 on the power play this season). And we haven't even begun to talk about things like quality of competition, quality of teammates, zone starts, face-off wins, or about a hundred other factors outside of an individual player's control.

Was Erik Haula (+12) 17 goals-worth better than Zenon Konopka (-5) this past season? Granted, Konopka is a pretty terrible hockey player, but I doubt it. Has Ryan Jones (even), who has only scored six points all season, been 33 goals better than Nail Yakupov (-33)? I sincerely doubt it. Has Steven Oleksy (+7) been 41 goals-worth better than Alex Ovechkin (-34)? Fat chance.

The take-away, friends, is that plus/minus is completely unreliable. It's meaningless. It's even worse than meaningless, because belief in plus/minus actively damages attempts at meaningful analysis. So please, let's stop using it.

The future holds the possibility to be great or terrible, and since it has not yet occurred it remains simultaneously both.

ok forgive me here spaulding, but instead of speaking in platitudes can you explain to me what "putting the team on your back" means? does ovechkin not score goals in the playoffs? when the team needs a goal does he tend to disappear a la zlatan ibrahimovic? like my guy vlad in the playoffs? what are we talking about here beyond mental imagery of alexander ovechkin looking like a wagon heading west in the 1800s?

The future holds the possibility to be great or terrible, and since it has not yet occurred it remains simultaneously both.

ok forgive me here spaulding, but instead of speaking in platitudes can you explain to me what "putting the team on your back" means? does ovechkin not score goals in the playoffs? when the team needs a goal does he tend to disappear a la zlatan ibrahimovic? like my guy vlad in the playoffs? what are we talking about here beyond mental imagery of alexander ovechkin looking like a wagon heading west in the 1800s?

I don't think he is as good as Toews.

Les Grobstein's huge hog is proof that God has a sense of humor, isn't it?

ok, fair enough. i didn't mean to be dickish i was only trying to better understand what you meant, and in saying that i've got a pretty clear picture here so thanks and go hawks!

The Capitals have been hamstrung by a parade of crappy coaches

The future holds the possibility to be great or terrible, and since it has not yet occurred it remains simultaneously both.