?

Wins

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

So is Gretzky the greatest player in your opinion?

He's second behind Gordie Howe.

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General Jim wears Fort Bragg down... to get it!

Third behind Howe and Mario Lemieux.

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This will always be the right answer

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There are only two examples of infinity: The universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the universe.

JORR wins again.

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<º)))><

Waiting for the time when I can finally say
That this has all been wonderful, but now I'm on my way

You're saying as an individual statistic?
Depends on the position.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

Gretzky is the all-time scoring leader before you even count the goals. "But goalies were bad in the '80s!" Sure, and the NHL Gordie Howe played most of his career in was a bullshit six-team league in which two of the six (Black Hawks and Rangers) were glorified farm clubs and you could fill out your rosters with chain-smoking hosers while most of the world couldn't come and play. So it's whatever. Lots of great players, but Gretzky is undeniably #1.

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The argument would be that he wasn't a two-way player.

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General Jim wears Fort Bragg down... to get it!

He really didn't have to be.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

Fair enough, but I would argue that Howe had as good an all-around game as any forward you could name plus he was a Gretzky-type scorer within the context of the game when he played.

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General Jim wears Fort Bragg down... to get it!

Goal differential is a pretty important team statistic. That tends to tell you who's for real and who isn't. Chicago ranks 9th, by the way.

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Solid point.
Damn. I kinda wanted to argue with you but your right goddamnit.

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

Well, Gordie Howe does have a bridge named after him. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordie_Ho ... nal_Bridge

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God is the uncaused cause of the universe. He had no beginning and has no end. He is not bound by the laws of the universe he created.

I was really going for individual hockey statistic but this is fine.

Is plus/minus the weakest stat? It always pissed me off to hear a guy was -4, but when you looked at who else was on the ice for the four goals...

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+/- is an adequate glimpse for defensemen and defensive forwards but tells you much less about offensive or two-way forwards. Marcus Kruger won't have a high +/- but there's probably something wrong if it's out-and-out bad.

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I'd like to enter the name of Bobby Orr into the conversation.

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Host of the weekly "We Fish ASA" podcast
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He wins the most boring autobiography for sure.

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Power is always in the hands of the masses of men. What oppresses the masses is their own ignorance, their own short-sighted selfishness.
- Henry George

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Good people drink good beer - Hunter S. Thompson

<º)))><

Waiting for the time when I can finally say
That this has all been wonderful, but now I'm on my way

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Sexual assault allegations

Conversion percentage on longer 5-on-3s, probably 30+ seconds.

Conversely, ability to avoid getting into such longer 5-on-3s.

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"When people want their version of the truth, they go find it, no matter how baseless their beliefs." -- Ken Rosenthal

Gretzky is on another planet relative to the rest...Ruthian if you will.

Most important stat? WAR

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This is an even dumber JORR hockey thought than when he said Hasek wasn't one of the all time great goalies.



Gretzky is unarguably the greatest individual in the history of professional team sports. hockey, baseball, basketball, football..doesn't matter, list the best and gretzky puts everyone of their GOATS to shame. The guy has more goals than anyone else in history has total points! Think about that for a second.

Howe was obviously amazing and the gold standard for NHL power forwards, but he can't even hold Gretzky's jock.

Some people argue Orr, but those people are idiots.

The Mt. Rushmore of Hockey has been set in stone for a while and the established order of the top 4 are Gretz, Orr, Lemieux, Howe (sometimes Howe is ahead of Mario).

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I never said Hasek wasn't one of the all-time greats. I said I thought there were a bunch of other guys who were better. You convinced me I was mistaken. You could be a little gracious about it.

In this case, there are a lot of people who still consider Howe the greatest.

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General Jim wears Fort Bragg down... to get it!

When have I ever been gracious about anything?

There are not a lot of people who consider Howe the greatest. I'd bet less than 5 in the world and that includes his relatives.

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