Of course, but that doesn't render hitting meaningless. It only means that pitching is more important. And I agree with that.

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They should have traded him in the offseason.

Roger and Leash are correct. W/L is a worthless metric for pitchers

For those who think W/L is meaningless for pitchers, do you also consider Peyton Manning and Tom Brady equals at the QB position?

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

So now we're comparing the W/L metric in different sports? It's silly in football, too.

Yes, and apples and apples comparison, FF

Well, that's really the best sports analogy I can come up with. Brady and Manning are essentially the same quality of QB. The only difference is that Brady has played better in bigger games and won more games and Super Bowls. Most consider Brady the GOAT and clearly better than Manning.

It basically comes down to whether you think emotions and the context of the game has an impact on players, or whether you think they have their craft so finely tuned by the time they become a professional that they are impervious to the emotions that should come with playing a competitive sport at the highest level.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Thete is no sports anology to a pitcher. Football is a terrible comparison, ad is everything else.

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It's not a perfect comparison, but it's a pretty good one. You have players who are primarily, but not solely, responsible for one side of the ball. They are not responsible for the other side of the ball whatsoever. And both are judged on their ability to outplay the other on big stages. A goalie in hockey might be a better comparison but neither one of us watches hockey so I'm not gonna use that.

Jose Quintana is Tony Romo.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

It shouldn't matter to White Sox fans what he is anymore. The only story that matters wrt Jose Quintana is the indefensible fact that he is still a member of the White Sox.

I will say this, FF has some tenacity this weekend. He won't back down in the Mayor Jew thread. He's not going to back down here either, so agree to disagree on my end...

Right. I think the emotions, the "guts", the ability to deal with pressure, whatever you want to call it, of the pitchers is a far greater variable than the difference between the vast majority of big league offenses and the only stat we have to measure that is W/L record over a large enough sample.

I always like to ask this question: If you took out the scoreboard and put the pitchers in seclusion between innings so they had no idea what the score of the game was, do you think that would have an effect on their W/L records?

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Ecclesiastes 5:8

True. Kenny and Hahn could fuck up a cup of coffee.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I would agree with that except it favors the W/L record for pitchers more because the difference between defenses in the space of an NFL game can vary much more than two offenses within the tiny space of a single baseball game. Ben Zobrist can look better than Mike Trout within the space of a single game. Especially if Zobrist is facing Quintana and Trout is facing a really good pitcher. In fact, Zobrist could look better than Trout over a week or even a month. You need many at-bats to definitively know that Trout is much better.

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Ecclesiastes 5:8

[quote="FavreFan"][quote="leashyourkids"]Thete is no sports anology to a pitcher. Football is a terrible comparison, ad is everything else.[/quote]
It's not a perfect comparison, but it's a pretty good one. You have players who are primarily, but not solely, responsible for one side of the ball. They are not responsible for the other side of the ball whatsoever. And both are judged on their ability to outplay the other on big stages. A goalie in hockey might be a better comparison but neither one of us watches hockey so I'm not gonna use that.

Jose Quintana is Tony Romo.[/quote]

No, it's a terrible analogy. Many will argue that baseball is an individual sport masked as a team sport. That's not entirely true, but it's a lot closer than any other sport. Football is the epitome of a team sport. The years Tom Brady had shit talent, his teams weren't nearly as good. It's happened to Rodgers lately too. But the W/L argument would conclude that none of that matters and they would merely have to outperform the guy on the other side. Obviously, that's not the case.

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DON'T TALK ABOUT SAMPLE SIZE AND VARIANCE AROUND SOX FANS. They will jump all over you because you're just making excuses!

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Also, my quoting on the prior post is perfect. This site can eat a dick.

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Unless PRICK is using a 7 game sample size to evaluate Kyle Schwarber

That is the way the game is viewed now, but it's wrong. And that's really the crux of the argument. It would be like saying Dead would be a better band if you replaced Mickey Hart with Buddy Rich and Jerry Garcia with Jimi Hendrix.

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Ecclesiastes 5:8

Cub fans also use a seven game sample to evaluate Schwarber. Rick is just using a different seven games than they are.

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Ecclesiastes 5:8

Tom Brady's teams have been very good ever since he was named a starter, regardless of his surrounding talent.

But you're missing my point. The point here is that almost every poster here agreed Brady was/is better than Manning after this past super bowl. IIRC, not one person made the argument that winning is a team accomplishment and Brady shouldn't get more credit for it. But when it comes to pitching, everyone seems in lock step that winning the game in question is irrelevant.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

I don't think it is either, but it's closer than any other team sport. And it's why it's statistics are much more meaningful than any other sport.

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viewtopic.php?f=75&t=105917#p2692606

Winning matters, except when it doesn't.

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

There's book coming out soon you should read.

https://m.harpercollins.com/97800624902 ... t-baseball

This is such a bad comparison on so many levels, I don't know where to start.

I'll just say that a QB impacts every single phase of the game in football. A pitcher has control over one aspect - runs scored.

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Let's just stop comparing football to baseball. They're completely different.

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That sounds good, but it's untrue.

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I think you mean runs allowed.

But you can't criticize my sports thought and then shit out a thought like that. QB's affect special teams now?

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Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Really? to the first sentence.

QBs absolutely affect special teams. It's easier to punt from your own 40 than your own 5.

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To the larger argument of W/L in baseball, I don't entirely dismiss it, but it's far from perfect, and it also takes a huge sample size to have any meaning.

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