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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:12 pm 
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Champ definitely needs to be mentioned in this discussion for those of us under 40 imo. I’m still taking Revis over him and not thinking all that hard about it though.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:12 pm 
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Not really a fan of the question because defending is too broad of a category... guys that were good at pass rushing aren't going to be any good at coverage... makes it difficult to compare across positions, but I will try my best.

41

  • Aeneas Williams
  • Brian Urlacher
  • Lawrence Taylor
  • Ray Lewis
  • Reggie White

I have another 20 guys I'd like to put in my top five. :) I put Aeneas up there because I am a Cardinals fan and like almost all Cardinals, he doesn't get the respect he deserves for how good he really was... but I would probably put Woodson or Bruce Smith in there for real over him.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:13 pm 
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RFDC wrote:
Charles Haley deserves a mention


Especially if he didn't piss all over your car.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:13 pm 
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I feel like if I were alive/cogent for LT he would have to be #1 by a huge margin. He totally reinvented OLB.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:14 pm 
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America wrote:
The thing about Bailey is he played CB like none have before or since. Had an almost psychic knowledge of where the ball was so he could cover his man but also ballhawk the way usually only safeties and the very rare MLB (basically just Urlacher, Lewis and briefly Keuchly have been able to do it at that position) can. I remember a game where somebody said he covers the ball. Never forget that, made so much sense then to describe how a CB who was a complete shutdown corner could still manufacture the kind of production he did.

Other great corners with Champ's coverage skills never were able to make the big plays Champ Bailey did because they covered their man in a way that prevented the ball from being thrown their way. The only one who ever truly covered an entire half of the field was Bailey.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:15 pm 
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America wrote:
I feel like if I were alive/cogent for LT he would have to be #1 by a huge margin. He totally reinvented OLB.

Absolutely.

Check out his episode on A Football Life.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:15 pm 
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America wrote:
The thing about Bailey is he played CB like none have before or since. Had an almost psychic knowledge of where the ball was so he could cover his man but also ballhawk the way usually only safeties and the very rare MLB (basically just Urlacher, Lewis and briefly Keuchly have been able to do it at that position) can. I remember a game where somebody said he covers the ball. Never forget that, made so much sense then to describe how a CB who was a complete shutdown corner could still manufacture the kind of production he did.

Other great corners with Champ's coverage skills never were able to make the big plays Champ Bailey did because they covered their man in a way that prevented the ball from being thrown their way. The only one who ever truly covered an entire half of the field was Bailey.

Speaking of unique CB skills, has any DB simply erased a side of the field like Nnamdi Asomugha did for like two years? The most perfect marriage of player skill and scheme ever. Then he became an Eagle and wasn’t an nfl player two years later. Crazy.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:16 pm 
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Bailey could cover and be a interception return threat, Revised never had that.

Deion could also take it to the house

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:16 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
Champ definitely needs to be mentioned in this discussion for those of us under 40 imo. I’m still taking Revis over him and not thinking all that hard about it though.


Mel Blount was far better than both of them. Coverage and laying the wood.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:16 pm 
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newper wrote:
Not really a fan of the question because defending is too broad of a category... guys that were good at pass rushing aren't going to be any good at coverage... makes it difficult to compare across positions, but I will try my best.

41

  • Aeneas Williams
  • Brian Urlacher
  • Lawrence Taylor
  • Ray Lewis
  • Reggie White

I have another 20 guys I'd like to put in my top five. :) I put Aeneas up there because I am a Cardinals fan and like almost all Cardinals, he doesn't get the respect he deserves for how good he really was... but I would probably put Woodson or Bruce Smith in there for real over him.

Aeneas was great. One of the first shutdown/playmaker corners not named Dieon from my youth that stood out.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:16 pm 
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1. Ray Lewis
2. Ed Reed
3. Prime Time
4. LT
5. Ronnie Lott

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:16 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
America wrote:
The thing about Bailey is he played CB like none have before or since. Had an almost psychic knowledge of where the ball was so he could cover his man but also ballhawk the way usually only safeties and the very rare MLB (basically just Urlacher, Lewis and briefly Keuchly have been able to do it at that position) can. I remember a game where somebody said he covers the ball. Never forget that, made so much sense then to describe how a CB who was a complete shutdown corner could still manufacture the kind of production he did.

Other great corners with Champ's coverage skills never were able to make the big plays Champ Bailey did because they covered their man in a way that prevented the ball from being thrown their way. The only one who ever truly covered an entire half of the field was Bailey.

Speaking of unique CB skills, has any DB simply erased a side of the field like Nnamdi Asomugha did for like two years? The most perfect marriage of player skill and scheme ever. Then he became an Eagle and wasn’t an nfl player two years later. Crazy.

Yea that's a good call. I remember him being called the greatest free agent ever by some people.

Another name, a very modern one, is Calais Campbell. Total unsung hero.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:17 pm 
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America wrote:
I feel like if I were alive/cogent for LT he would have to be #1 by a huge margin. He totally reinvented OLB.

+1. He seems like the guy for anyone who’s old like dr Ken and reader.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:18 pm 
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:19 pm 
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Patrick Willis also an honorable mention. Probably 3rd best MLB behind Urlacher and Lewis.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:19 pm 
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Regular Reader wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Champ definitely needs to be mentioned in this discussion for those of us under 40 imo. I’m still taking Revis over him and not thinking all that hard about it though.


Mel Blount was far better than both of them. Coverage and laying the wood.

I don’t believe you. I’ve never heard of a Blount Island.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:20 pm 
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Great story of LT when Hoodie was DC for the Giants. He is going over stuff on the board and LT is sleeping. He rips him for sleeping in the meeting. LT takes the marker from him and puts up their entire pass rush scheme for that week and then says I am going back to sleep. Hoodie says he was the smartest football player he ever coached.

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Last edited by RFDC on Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:21 pm 
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It probably happened before but Deion was the first guy I'd seen that completely shut down one side of the field. Teams just didn't throw that way. I'd never seen that.

Yeah, he couldn't tackle anyone. But...didn't seem to matter.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:23 pm 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
It probably happened before but Deion was the first guy I'd seen that completely shut down one side of the field. Teams just didn't throw that way. I'd never seen that.

Yeah, he couldn't tackle anyone. But...didn't seem to matter.

Like Reggie he was just before my time.

That’s how I feel about Revis. Sometimes they threw though. It was usually a mistake.

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Last edited by FavreFan on Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:23 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
Regular Reader wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Champ definitely needs to be mentioned in this discussion for those of us under 40 imo. I’m still taking Revis over him and not thinking all that hard about it though.


Mel Blount was far better than both of them. Coverage and laying the wood.

I don’t believe you. I’ve never heard of a Blount Island.


He handed out concussions like Bob Sanders missed games. Plus he has his own rules change and still was all pro afterwards.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:24 pm 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
It probably happened before but Deion was the first guy I'd seen that completely shut down one side of the field. Teams just didn't throw that way. I'd never seen that.

Yeah, he couldn't tackle anyone. But...didn't seem to matter.

Sick thing is....if Deion played now, with today's rules...he'd be MORE dominant.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:25 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
America wrote:
I feel like if I were alive/cogent for LT he would have to be #1 by a huge margin. He totally reinvented OLB.

+1. He seems like the guy for anyone who’s old like dr Ken and reader.


Much like Wes Mantooth from Anchorman, I pure, straight hated him but goddamnit I respected him.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:26 pm 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
It probably happened before but Deion was the first guy I'd seen that completely shut down one side of the field. Teams just didn't throw that way. I'd never seen that.

Yeah, he couldn't tackle anyone. But...didn't seem to matter.


And the only guy who could stop Jerry Rice.

With or without help

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:27 pm 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
America wrote:
I feel like if I were alive/cogent for LT he would have to be #1 by a huge margin. He totally reinvented OLB.

+1. He seems like the guy for anyone who’s old like dr Ken and reader.


Much like Wes Mantooth from Anchorman, I pure, straight hated him but goddamnit I respected him.

That’s how I’ve felt about Urlacher. No other athlete in any other sport is like that yet for me. Maybe LeBron. But nah, fuck him.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:30 pm 
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Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
America wrote:
I feel like if I were alive/cogent for LT he would have to be #1 by a huge margin. He totally reinvented OLB.

+1. He seems like the guy for anyone who’s old like dr Ken and reader.


Much like Wes Mantooth from Anchorman, I pure, straight hated him but goddamnit I respected him.


It was funny, in 1979, Hugh Green at Pitt was in discussion as the greatest disruptive college linebacker of all time. A year later LT made him an afterthought.

Edit: if iirc, he almost won the Heisman.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:35 pm 
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It seems crazy to me that we only have one Keuchley mention so far and it’s in reference to his pass coverage. Even with the concussions I think he stands with the greats.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2018 11:37 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
It seems crazy to me that we only have one Keuchley mention so far and it’s in reference to his pass coverage. Even with the concussions I think he stands with the greats.

Needs more years... same with Mack... could be in the list sometime but he is only in his 7th year, so not quite enough yet. Kind of like Sale pitching -- everything is on track, but need some more years.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:48 am 
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41

LT
Reggie White
Ray Lewis
Brian Urlacher
Ronnie Lott

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:54 am 
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newper wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
It seems crazy to me that we only have one Keuchley mention so far and it’s in reference to his pass coverage. Even with the concussions I think he stands with the greats.

Needs more years... same with Mack... could be in the list sometime but he is only in his 7th year, so not quite enough yet. Kind of like Sale pitching -- everything is on track, but need some more years.

I think peak Keuchly had sadly come and gone.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 8:10 am 
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Deion Sanders
Ray Lewis
Ronnie Lott
Too Tall Jones
Wilber Marshall

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