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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 1:57 pm 
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IMU wrote:
billypootons wrote:
i used to be pro team... but now, im pro player... hold out and get your money. if they can easily discard you if you get seriously hurt... then you should be able to use whatever leverage you have to get more money now

There must be a penalty for not adhering to the contract that you signed.


:roll: there is a penalty... once the contract dispute is over and they have agreed to new terms most teams choose to waive enforcement of the penalties accrued


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 2:16 pm 
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IMU wrote:
There must be a penalty for not adhering to the contract that you signed.
So what what penalty do you think the owners/teams should pay when they choose to not adhere to a contract they signed and decide to cut a player?

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 2:17 pm 
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Mike Ditka in 1987 wrote:
There must be a penalty for not adhering to the contract that you signed.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 2:57 pm 
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Just remembered IMU’s favorite team has Kirk Cousins. Now it makes sense that he thinks there wouldn’t be a noticeable difference between pro and scab players.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:04 pm 
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Drones...

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:34 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
Just remembered IMU’s favorite team has Kirk Cousins. Now it makes sense that he thinks there wouldn’t be a noticeable difference between pro and scab players.

C'mon now! Cousins had a 91 rating in that one playoff game half a decade ago!

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:40 pm 
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IMU wrote:
Drones...

Were those even around in 1987?

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:25 pm 
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Cousins threw for 4k plus last year with 30 and 10. If mitch did that we'd be celebrating a SB win. Cousins is no bum. He'll be even better in his 2nd season with the Vikes.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 7:47 pm 
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312player wrote:
Cousins threw for 4k plus last year with 30 and 10. If mitch did that we'd be celebrating a SB win. Cousins is no bum. He'll be even better in his 2nd season with the Vikes.


If you did more than look at the back of his football card you would recognize that he's a bum slayer. Mitch outplayed him in both games and there is a LONG trend of him sucking against teams with a winning record.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2019 8:57 pm 
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I dunno about outplayed him, i remember Mitch throwing two picks and like 150 yards. I like Cousins, he's overpaid but he doesnt suck.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:23 am 
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I hope Larry Fitzgerald never retires

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:24 am 
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FavreFan wrote:


I hope Larry Fitzgerald never retires


Wasted talent. He'll be forgotten in 10 years.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:27 am 
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Nas wrote:
FavreFan wrote:


I hope Larry Fitzgerald never retires


Wasted talent. He'll be forgotten in 10 years.


I've been surprised by seeing him on the field over the last two seasons .

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:33 am 
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Nas wrote:
312player wrote:
Cousins threw for 4k plus last year with 30 and 10. If mitch did that we'd be celebrating a SB win. Cousins is no bum. He'll be even better in his 2nd season with the Vikes.


If you did more than look at the back of his football card you would recognize that he's a bum slayer. Mitch outplayed him in both games and there is a LONG trend of him sucking against teams with a winning record.


Kirk Cousins the last 4 seasons...

Record against teams that finished the season at or below 8-8: (27-8-2)

Record against teams that finished the season above 8-8: (5-22)


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:34 am 
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Nas wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
IMU wrote:
Attempting a hold out should result in an immediate forfeiture of any currently agreed upon guaranteed funds and a year suspension from the NFL.
I can't blame any player who does it in the last year of their rookie deal. Those deals are almost completely non-negotiable.

I do think there is an issue with someone who signs a huge deal with a huge signing bonus to get the money up front and then is mad that in the last year they aren't getting paid a huge amount per year.


Why? I imagine most fans aren't upset when a team cuts a player who isn't very good to save millions of dollars. I would be more understanding if we were talking about fully guaranteed contracts.

In the last year they are getting the complete contract.

Here is an example.
4 year contract for 100 million dollars.
15 million dollar signing bonus.
Year 1: 25 million
Year 2: 25 million
Year 3: 25 million
Year 4: 10 million

So, a player gets to year 4 and says "I'm worth more than 10 million!" not realizing that it simply was how the contract was paid out to get to the total value of it. In the last year, there really is no worry about guaranteed money because they are going to get 100% of the money of the contract they signed. The teams, often frontload these contracts which is good for the player but then the player turns around and gets mad that the last year they are making below market.

Now, the simple solution seems to be to backload all contracts so the last year is even bigger but the players obviously wouldn't want that for multiple reasons.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:39 am 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Nas wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
IMU wrote:
Attempting a hold out should result in an immediate forfeiture of any currently agreed upon guaranteed funds and a year suspension from the NFL.
I can't blame any player who does it in the last year of their rookie deal. Those deals are almost completely non-negotiable.

I do think there is an issue with someone who signs a huge deal with a huge signing bonus to get the money up front and then is mad that in the last year they aren't getting paid a huge amount per year.


Why? I imagine most fans aren't upset when a team cuts a player who isn't very good to save millions of dollars. I would be more understanding if we were talking about fully guaranteed contracts.

In the last year they are getting the complete contract.

Here is an example.
4 year contract for 100 million dollars.
15 million dollar signing bonus.
Year 1: 25 million
Year 2: 25 million
Year 3: 25 million
Year 4: 10 million

So, a player gets to year 4 and says "I'm worth more than 10 million!" not realizing that it simply was how the contract was paid out to get to the total value of it. In the last year, there really is no worry about guaranteed money because they are going to get 100% of the money of the contract they signed. The teams, often frontload these contracts which is good for the player but then the player turns around and gets mad that the last year they are making below market.

Now, the simple solution seems to be to backload all contracts so the last year is even bigger but the players obviously wouldn't want that for multiple reasons.


In your example, I think it's more about a player looking for another payday while they are still good or the market has dramatically changed. Change in the market is why Rodgers got new money. Kirk Cousins couldn't be a higher paid QB.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:41 am 
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Nas wrote:
FavreFan wrote:


I hope Larry Fitzgerald never retires


Wasted talent. He'll be forgotten in 10 years.

Not likely.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 10:43 am 
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Nas wrote:
In your example, I think it's more about a player looking for another payday while they are still good or the market has dramatically changed. Change in the market is why Rodgers got new money. Kirk Cousins couldn't be a higher paid QB.
I agree but that is why I think it's different than a rookie deal holdout where the player had no real chance to negotiate and the contract is easy to outperform.

I understand the player wanting to get another big payday but if it was a player on my team that was going to have a season not be as good because of it on a contract they negotiated and were paid very well on an average basis I wouldn't like it as much.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 2:26 pm 
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billypootons wrote:
Nas wrote:
312player wrote:
Cousins threw for 4k plus last year with 30 and 10. If mitch did that we'd be celebrating a SB win. Cousins is no bum. He'll be even better in his 2nd season with the Vikes.


If you did more than look at the back of his football card you would recognize that he's a bum slayer. Mitch outplayed him in both games and there is a LONG trend of him sucking against teams with a winning record.


Kirk Cousins the last 4 seasons...

Record against teams that finished the season at or below 8-8: (27-8-2)

Record against teams that finished the season above 8-8: (5-22)


My guy! This tells you all you need to know

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 2:37 pm 
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The skins were an incompetent organization, if that continues under Zimmer and the vikes..ill agree.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 2:41 pm 
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312player wrote:
The skins were an incompetent organization, if that continues under Zimmer and the vikes..ill agree.
A tiger cannot change his stripes.

6 of Cousins 8 wins last season were against teams that finished 8-8 or worse.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 2:41 pm 
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312player wrote:
The skins were an incompetent organization, if that continues under Zimmer and the vikes..ill agree.

If?

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 2:45 pm 
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I never thought 312 would manhandle FF like this.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 2:51 pm 
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IMU wrote:
I never thought 312 would manhandle FF like this.

Yes you did.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 3:36 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:
Mike Daniels released by GB today. Low class move by the Packers to do it right before camp starts. Some team is gonna get a good DL.
Signing with the Lions.

Between facing him and Khalil Mack, Aaron Rodgers will be lucky to emerge from this season alive.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 3:41 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
FavreFan wrote:
Mike Daniels released by GB today. Low class move by the Packers to do it right before camp starts. Some team is gonna get a good DL.
Signing with the Lions.

Between facing him and Khalil Mack, Aaron Rodgers will be lucky to emerge from this season alive.

Every DL in the division is going to be tough. You'll find that out week 1.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 3:48 pm 
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This will come in handy if Aaron Jones is traded to Chicago

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 3:49 pm 
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all you need is the week 17 game against the bears to judge cousins. the team was win and get in (i think?)... and they played like absolute dogshit at home against a good team that had no incentive to win.


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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 3:56 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:


This will come in handy if Aaron Jones is traded to Chicago


Sounds like a bad guy just like Rodgers. High school kids want more than a movie ticket.

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 Post subject: Re: NFL Camps/Preseason
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 3:57 pm 
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FavreFan wrote:


This will come in handy if Aaron Jones is traded to Chicago
Looks more like it will come in handy this year


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