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 Post subject: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:13 pm 
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It was 1 game. Most teams have at least 1 bad loss and this was ours. We'll bounce back after the week off.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:28 pm 
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Nas wrote:
It was 1 game. Most teams have at least 1 bad loss and this was ours. We'll bounce back after the week off.


What about game 1?

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:33 pm 
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The Bears performance overall concerns me much more than their record. They have had one great game start to finish this season.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:53 pm 
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Unless the O-line improves, it's gonna be a long year.


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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:54 pm 
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These are the times we need a Nas at the controls

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 2:01 pm 
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Does one week off fix Nagy's weakness as a play-caller. Doesn't appears like he's out-scheming teams anymore


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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 2:08 pm 
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Kirkwood wrote:
Does one week off fix Nagy's weakness as a play-caller. Doesn't appears like he's out-scheming teams anymore


You misspelled out-gimmicking.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 2:10 pm 
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Kirkwood wrote:
Does one week off fix Nagy's weakness as a play-caller. Doesn't appears like he's out-scheming teams anymore
If one week off gets Leno Jr to learn the rules and stop holding, Kyle Long to get four years younger and heal up 100%, and the rest of the Olinemen to start doing their jobs a lot better, then yes.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:09 pm 
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I'm willing to sweep this loss away - it was overseas, Nagy didn't fly in earlier like he should have, and despite being down 17-0 the Bears did what good teams are supposed to do and roared back to take the lead. Very uncharacteristic of the defense to give up a long drive to what appears to be an average or slightly above average offense, one missing its top wideout no less. But I'll give them a pass. Running game/o-line still suck.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:10 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Very uncharacteristic of the defense to give up a long drive to what appears to be an average or slightly above average offense
Nas, you're up.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:15 pm 
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Its the worst tackling I've seen out of them in a long time.


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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:25 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Very uncharacteristic of the defense to give up a long drive to what appears to be an average or slightly above average offense
Nas, you're up.



:lol:


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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:29 pm 
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I'm being a little facetious, but he has a point. The defense has blown quite a few 4th quarter leads. Its an alarming trend. Almost as alarming as the Bears lack of offense.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:47 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
I'm being a little facetious, but he has a point. The defense has blown quite a few 4th quarter leads. Its an alarming trend. Almost as alarming as the Bears lack of offense.


Are you going back to last year or just this year? They are still second overall in points given up per game this year. I think the metric of "giving up leads" is misleading, here's why: if the Bears gave up seven points in the first quarter then nothing else all game and lost 3-7, no one would blame the defense. But if the Bears gave up those seven points in the last seconds of the fourth quarter instead and lost 3-7, it seems you would blame the defense for "giving up the lead." I see an inconsistency there. They performed well in both scenarios. I see defense as output over the entirety of the game, not just when you're protecting a lead. The defense is def at fault in the Raiders game, but I don't see how they're at fault in the Packers or other games. Their production in those games was again good enough for second overall. To ask more than that is to simply imply how bad the offense is.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:55 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Are you going back to last year or just this year?
Both.

@Miami, @NYG, playoffs against the Eagles, @Broncos, and again yesterday the Bears held the lead late in the 4th quarter, only to see the defense give up points in the waning seconds of regulation.

I know the defense is really damn good, waywayway ahead of the offense, but the trend they have of blowing leads late is not a good thing. Nas was on this last year and I more or less dismissed him because the team overall was so good. Now that its happened again twice in five weeks, the D worries me more and more.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:00 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Are you going back to last year or just this year?
Both.

@Miami, @NYG, playoffs against the Eagles, @Broncos, and again yesterday the Bears held the lead late in the 4th quarter, only to see the defense give up points in the waning seconds of regulation.

I know the defense is really damn good, waywayway ahead of the offense, but the trend they have of blowing leads late is not a good thing.


If the defense is good - good enough for second overall this year so far, including the abnormally bad Raiders game - and you notice that they're giving up leads, then mathemathically speaking this means the Bears offense is really really really bad. This means that scoring more than 13.8 points (what the Bears give up on average this year) is a challenge for them. If we need the Bears to stop giving up leads then the offense needs to do better. I don't see any ground to blame the defense this year aside from the Raiders game. Nas' boy needs to step up.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:01 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Are you going back to last year or just this year?
Both.

@Miami, @NYG, playoffs against the Eagles, @Broncos, and again yesterday the Bears held the lead late in the 4th quarter, only to see the defense give up points in the waning seconds of regulation.

I know the defense is really damn good, waywayway ahead of the offense, but the trend they have of blowing leads late is not a good thing. Nas was on this last year and I more or less dismissed him because the team overall was so good. Now that its happened again twice in five weeks, the D worries me more and more.


It seems like their conditioning is insufficient for them to maintain a high level of play in the 4Q. That may be because the offense puts them under so much stress compared to other teams.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:08 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Are you going back to last year or just this year?
Both.

@Miami, @NYG, playoffs against the Eagles, @Broncos, and again yesterday the Bears held the lead late in the 4th quarter, only to see the defense give up points in the waning seconds of regulation.

I know the defense is really damn good, waywayway ahead of the offense, but the trend they have of blowing leads late is not a good thing. Nas was on this last year and I more or less dismissed him because the team overall was so good. Now that its happened again twice in five weeks, the D worries me more and more.


It seems like their conditioning is insufficient for them to maintain a high level of play in the 4Q. That may be because the offense puts them under so much stress compared to other teams.


Yes, you're asking them to hold defenses under what the putrid offense can score, which is not very much. It's an unfair standard. It's not conditioning - it's (Pro Bowl QB) Trubisky.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:12 pm 
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It doesn't matter what the circumstances are. What does it matter if the score is 14-13 or its 35-31? If the Bears have the lead late, the defense has almost routinely given up that lead. The D let a mediocre at best Raiders team march 93 yards for a game winning TD yesterday, and the D let statue Joe Flacco engineer a TD drive in minute 59 of that game as well. Big problem.

I haven't praised the offense, they are a problem too. Penalties are a problem. The lack of a running game and scheme is a problem. Fortunately they have a bye and a few extra days/practices to possibly sort this out. If we're still talking about these issues in week 9, the season is likely over in terms of making the playoffs.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:14 pm 
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Peoria Matt wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Very uncharacteristic of the defense to give up a long drive to what appears to be an average or slightly above average offense
Nas, you're up.



:lol:


+ :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:17 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
I'm being a little facetious, but he has a point. The defense has blown quite a few 4th quarter leads. Its an alarming trend. Almost as alarming as the Bears lack of offense.


Are you going back to last year or just this year? They are still second overall in points given up per game this year. I think the metric of "giving up leads" is misleading, here's why: if the Bears gave up seven points in the first quarter then nothing else all game and lost 3-7, no one would blame the defense. But if the Bears gave up those seven points in the last seconds of the fourth quarter instead and lost 3-7, it seems you would blame the defense for "giving up the lead." I see an inconsistency there. They performed well in both scenarios. I see defense as output over the entirety of the game, not just when you're protecting a lead. The defense is def at fault in the Raiders game, but I don't see how they're at fault in the Packers or other games. Their production in those games was again good enough for second overall. To ask more than that is to simply imply how bad the offense is.

This was the defense of many LeBron supporters. He played great for 3 quarter so don't blame him for wetting the bed in the 4th quarter.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:19 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Are you going back to last year or just this year?
Both.

@Miami, @NYG, playoffs against the Eagles, @Broncos, and again yesterday the Bears held the lead late in the 4th quarter, only to see the defense give up points in the waning seconds of regulation.

I know the defense is really damn good, waywayway ahead of the offense, but the trend they have of blowing leads late is not a good thing. Nas was on this last year and I more or less dismissed him because the team overall was so good. Now that its happened again twice in five weeks, the D worries me more and more.


It seems like their conditioning is insufficient for them to maintain a high level of play in the 4Q. That may be because the offense puts them under so much stress compared to other teams.


This has been true even when the offense scores points or win ToP.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:20 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
It doesn't matter what the circumstances are. What does it matter if the score is 14-13 or its 35-31? If the Bears have the lead late, the defense has almost routinely given up that lead. The D let a mediocre at best Raiders team march 93 yards for a game winning TD yesterday, and the D let statue Joe Flacco engineer a TD drive in minute 59 of that game as well. Big problem.

I haven't praised the offense, they are a problem too. Penalties are a problem. The lack of a running game and scheme is a problem. Fortunately they have a bye and a few extra days/practices to possibly sort this out. If we're still talking about these issues in week 9, the season is likely over in terms of making the playoffs.


Frank speaks the truth.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:23 pm 
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Frank Coztansa wrote:
It doesn't matter what the circumstances are. What does it matter if the score is 14-13 or its 35-31? If the Bears have the lead late, the defense has almost routinely given up that lead. The D let a mediocre at best Raiders team march 93 yards for a game winning TD yesterday, and the D let statue Joe Flacco engineer a TD drive in minute 59 of that game as well. Big problem.

I haven't praised the offense, they are a problem too. Penalties are a problem. The lack of a running game and scheme is a problem. Fortunately they have a bye and a few extra days/practices to possibly sort this out. If we're still talking about these issues in week 9, the season is likely over in terms of making the playoffs.


Circumstances definitely matter - I already laid this out in a hypothetical 3-7 Bears loss that I wrote about above. I said you're probably not saying anything if the Bears give up 7 in the first and lose 3-7. You'd probably praise them. But if they lose 3-7 on a last second TD drive then you, Frank, probably blame them for giving up the lead. Is that not true? But they played fantastic to me in both cases. The offense just needs to score more.

We agree on the Bears D blowing the Raiders game. I think they lost that game in the first half. For me if you're only giving up 13.8 ppg then I don't care when you give up the points I only care about how much you give up. It's enough for me that you're only giving up 13.8 - you've met my expectations. The expectation should be for the offense to score more in this case.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:25 pm 
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Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Are you going back to last year or just this year?
Both.

@Miami, @NYG, playoffs against the Eagles, @Broncos, and again yesterday the Bears held the lead late in the 4th quarter, only to see the defense give up points in the waning seconds of regulation.

I know the defense is really damn good, waywayway ahead of the offense, but the trend they have of blowing leads late is not a good thing. Nas was on this last year and I more or less dismissed him because the team overall was so good. Now that its happened again twice in five weeks, the D worries me more and more.


It seems like their conditioning is insufficient for them to maintain a high level of play in the 4Q. That may be because the offense puts them under so much stress compared to other teams.


This has been true even when the offense scores points or win ToP.


So the best defense last year and second best so far this year somehow has "insufficient conditioning." Bad thought.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:27 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
It doesn't matter what the circumstances are. What does it matter if the score is 14-13 or its 35-31? If the Bears have the lead late, the defense has almost routinely given up that lead. The D let a mediocre at best Raiders team march 93 yards for a game winning TD yesterday, and the D let statue Joe Flacco engineer a TD drive in minute 59 of that game as well. Big problem.

I haven't praised the offense, they are a problem too. Penalties are a problem. The lack of a running game and scheme is a problem. Fortunately they have a bye and a few extra days/practices to possibly sort this out. If we're still talking about these issues in week 9, the season is likely over in terms of making the playoffs.


Circumstances definitely matter - I already laid this out in a hypothetical 3-7 Bears loss that I wrote about above. I said you're probably not saying anything if the Bears give up 7 in the first and lose 3-7. You'd probably praise them. But if they lose 3-7 on a last second TD drive then you, Frank, probably blame them for giving up the lead. Is that not true? But they played fantastic to me in both cases. The offense just needs to score more.

We agree on the Bears D blowing the Raiders game. I think they lost that game in the first half. For me if you're only giving up 13.8 ppg then I don't care when you give up the points I only care about how much you give up. It's enough for me that you're only giving up 13.8 - you've met my expectations. The expectation should be for the offense to score more in this case.


It matters when you suck. I expect a great defense to finish strong or get the critical stop. I blamed Fangio for it all last season but now it's clear that it's the players.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:28 pm 
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Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
It doesn't matter what the circumstances are. What does it matter if the score is 14-13 or its 35-31? If the Bears have the lead late, the defense has almost routinely given up that lead. The D let a mediocre at best Raiders team march 93 yards for a game winning TD yesterday, and the D let statue Joe Flacco engineer a TD drive in minute 59 of that game as well. Big problem.

I haven't praised the offense, they are a problem too. Penalties are a problem. The lack of a running game and scheme is a problem. Fortunately they have a bye and a few extra days/practices to possibly sort this out. If we're still talking about these issues in week 9, the season is likely over in terms of making the playoffs.


Circumstances definitely matter - I already laid this out in a hypothetical 3-7 Bears loss that I wrote about above. I said you're probably not saying anything if the Bears give up 7 in the first and lose 3-7. You'd probably praise them. But if they lose 3-7 on a last second TD drive then you, Frank, probably blame them for giving up the lead. Is that not true? But they played fantastic to me in both cases. The offense just needs to score more.

We agree on the Bears D blowing the Raiders game. I think they lost that game in the first half. For me if you're only giving up 13.8 ppg then I don't care when you give up the points I only care about how much you give up. It's enough for me that you're only giving up 13.8 - you've met my expectations. The expectation should be for the offense to score more in this case.


It matters when you suck. I expect a great defense to finish strong or get the critical stop. I blamed Fangio for it all last season but now it's clear that it's the players.


What you're basically saying is that the best defense in the league isn't good enough for you. You've got blinders on here.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:29 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Are you going back to last year or just this year?
Both.

@Miami, @NYG, playoffs against the Eagles, @Broncos, and again yesterday the Bears held the lead late in the 4th quarter, only to see the defense give up points in the waning seconds of regulation.

I know the defense is really damn good, waywayway ahead of the offense, but the trend they have of blowing leads late is not a good thing. Nas was on this last year and I more or less dismissed him because the team overall was so good. Now that its happened again twice in five weeks, the D worries me more and more.


It seems like their conditioning is insufficient for them to maintain a high level of play in the 4Q. That may be because the offense puts them under so much stress compared to other teams.


This has been true even when the offense scores points or win ToP.


So the best defense last year and second best so far this year somehow has "insufficient conditioning." Bad thought.


They have an uncanny ability to give up a lot of points in the 4th quarter. Sometimes it costs the Bears games and other times the game is closer than it needs to be.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:30 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Frank Coztansa wrote:
It doesn't matter what the circumstances are. What does it matter if the score is 14-13 or its 35-31? If the Bears have the lead late, the defense has almost routinely given up that lead. The D let a mediocre at best Raiders team march 93 yards for a game winning TD yesterday, and the D let statue Joe Flacco engineer a TD drive in minute 59 of that game as well. Big problem.

I haven't praised the offense, they are a problem too. Penalties are a problem. The lack of a running game and scheme is a problem. Fortunately they have a bye and a few extra days/practices to possibly sort this out. If we're still talking about these issues in week 9, the season is likely over in terms of making the playoffs.


Circumstances definitely matter - I already laid this out in a hypothetical 3-7 Bears loss that I wrote about above. I said you're probably not saying anything if the Bears give up 7 in the first and lose 3-7. You'd probably praise them. But if they lose 3-7 on a last second TD drive then you, Frank, probably blame them for giving up the lead. Is that not true? But they played fantastic to me in both cases. The offense just needs to score more.

We agree on the Bears D blowing the Raiders game. I think they lost that game in the first half. For me if you're only giving up 13.8 ppg then I don't care when you give up the points I only care about how much you give up. It's enough for me that you're only giving up 13.8 - you've met my expectations. The expectation should be for the offense to score more in this case.


It matters when you suck. I expect a great defense to finish strong or get the critical stop. I blamed Fangio for it all last season but now it's clear that it's the players.


What you're basically saying is that the best defense in the league isn't good enough for you. You've got blinders on here.


It's the same thing many of us said about LeBron. To be considered the greatest you have to be able to close.

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 Post subject: Re: R-E-L-A-X
PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:33 pm 
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The Bears finished first in defense last year by a wide margin. Let me know your thoughts on how they can do better.

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