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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 2:10 pm 
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Antarctica wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Antarctica wrote:
312player wrote:
I'm assuming America is pissed that the Sox didn't pull the trade off. That's a very weak haul for Betts.

I had initially thought it was more when news of the trade was first breaking. The White Sox could've beaten this offer by giving up either one of Madrigal or Vaughn, not even both. I bet they could've swung it for a package as paltry as Cease and Stiever, maybe having to toss in one of the high school righties they took last year to push that deal over the top.

But the Dodgers got him basically for free. They gave up nothing they give a shit about.

Verdugo is not nothing? He is pretty good young player

He's a brat. A ticking time bomb.

ok I guess I don't know much about the kid personality wise...what are you basing this on?

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 2:11 pm 
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Red Sox got raped. They still own half of Price's contract. It's obvious they were desperate about getting out from under the luxury tax.


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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 3:15 pm 
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Nardi wrote:
Red Sox got raped. They still own half of Price's contract. It's obvious they were desperate about getting out from under the luxury tax.


Not good when teams like the Cubs and Boston are moving their top players in their prime to get under the luxury tax. The tax is bad for the game.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 3:28 pm 
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No, poor drafting and handing out stupid contracts is bad for the game.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 3:32 pm 
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312player wrote:
Nardi wrote:
Red Sox got raped. They still own half of Price's contract. It's obvious they were desperate about getting out from under the luxury tax.


Not good when teams like the Cubs and Boston are moving their top players in their prime to get under the luxury tax. The tax is bad for the game.


I disagree. I think the tax is fine. In fact they should have a more firm cap. The problem in how it got set up is no floor to eliminate the small teams pocketing the welfare checks. If baseball ever had parity like football it would be so beautiful and grow the game immensely.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 3:39 pm 
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Yep. MLB needs a salary cap and a salary floor.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 3:56 pm 
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312player wrote:
Nardi wrote:
Red Sox got raped. They still own half of Price's contract. It's obvious they were desperate about getting out from under the luxury tax.


Not good when teams like the Cubs and Boston are moving their top players in their prime to get under the luxury tax. The tax is bad for the game.


Bernstein was saying the same thing this morning, but I have to disagree. One of the other "haves," to use Bernstein's language, is going to sign Betts next off season to a huge contract. It's just not going to be the Cubs or the Red Sox. The luxury tax is just spreading these guys around and not letting them pool on one team.


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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:10 pm 
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The Angels are loading up.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:17 pm 
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GoldenJet wrote:
The Angels are loading up.

Kinda. But are they a threat? Maybe to Oakland.


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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:30 pm 
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Anaheim still lacking pitching.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:31 pm 
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Warren Newson wrote:
312player wrote:
Nardi wrote:
Red Sox got raped. They still own half of Price's contract. It's obvious they were desperate about getting out from under the luxury tax.


Not good when teams like the Cubs and Boston are moving their top players in their prime to get under the luxury tax. The tax is bad for the game.


Bernstein was saying the same thing this morning, but I have to disagree. One of the other "haves," to use Bernstein's language, is going to sign Betts next off season to a huge contract. It's just not going to be the Cubs or the Red Sox. The luxury tax is just spreading these guys around and not letting them pool on one team.


What five teams do you feel have the biggest disadvantage in terms of having a large payroll?

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:37 pm 
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no team has a disadvantage having financial resources. that's Bernstein idiocy.

The luxury tax is doing exactly posed to do. I do agree, a floor is desperately needed. You take the handout, you should have to spend it on payroll.

Parity makes the game better....I love the parity aspect of the NFL.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:55 pm 
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312player wrote:
Warren Newson wrote:
312player wrote:
Nardi wrote:
Red Sox got raped. They still own half of Price's contract. It's obvious they were desperate about getting out from under the luxury tax.


Not good when teams like the Cubs and Boston are moving their top players in their prime to get under the luxury tax. The tax is bad for the game.


Bernstein was saying the same thing this morning, but I have to disagree. One of the other "haves," to use Bernstein's language, is going to sign Betts next off season to a huge contract. It's just not going to be the Cubs or the Red Sox. The luxury tax is just spreading these guys around and not letting them pool on one team.


What five teams do you feel have the biggest disadvantage in terms of having a large payroll?


I don't think any team that has the resources to maintain a large payroll has any meaningful competitive disadvantage just by virtue of their high payroll. However, some of them have put themselves in a disadvantageous situation by agreeing to bad contracts.


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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:39 am 
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Nardi wrote:
Red Sox got raped. They still own half of Price's contract. It's obvious they were desperate about getting out from under the luxury tax.


I can't imagine how pissed Red Sox nation is right now. They did get royally screwed in that deal. And their return was nowhere near what it should have been.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:44 am 
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Warren Newson wrote:
312player wrote:
Warren Newson wrote:
312player wrote:
Nardi wrote:
Red Sox got raped. They still own half of Price's contract. It's obvious they were desperate about getting out from under the luxury tax.


Not good when teams like the Cubs and Boston are moving their top players in their prime to get under the luxury tax. The tax is bad for the game.


Bernstein was saying the same thing this morning, but I have to disagree. One of the other "haves," to use Bernstein's language, is going to sign Betts next off season to a huge contract. It's just not going to be the Cubs or the Red Sox. The luxury tax is just spreading these guys around and not letting them pool on one team.


What five teams do you feel have the biggest disadvantage in terms of having a large payroll?


I don't think any team that has the resources to maintain a large payroll has any meaningful competitive disadvantage just by virtue of their high payroll. However, some of them have put themselves in a disadvantageous situation by agreeing to bad contracts.


I'm asking for teams with a disadvantage, my point was even the smallest market team is owned by a billionaire, me at likely said billionaire bought the team for 60-200 million and saw their investment soar into the billions.

These guys can all afford a 200 plus million payroll..they just want to pocket that money.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:22 pm 
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312player wrote:
Anaheim still lacking pitching.


After the trade the Angels are the 4th best team in baseball according to FanGraphs. I see a lot of 7-5 wins this season. The starting pitching is improved with the additions of Ohtani, Stripling, Teheran, and Bundy but at best they're probably 15th in MLB. Ohtani has ace stuff, Stripling has some crazy metrics and Canning looks promising so the top half might be in good shape. The most important thing will be the starters getting thru 5 on a fairly consistent basis so the bullpen doesn't get blown out before June. The bullpen should be pretty good...Eppler has been stocking up on power arms.


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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 5:42 pm 
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RFDC wrote:
Antarctica wrote:
RFDC wrote:
Antarctica wrote:
312player wrote:
I'm assuming America is pissed that the Sox didn't pull the trade off. That's a very weak haul for Betts.

I had initially thought it was more when news of the trade was first breaking. The White Sox could've beaten this offer by giving up either one of Madrigal or Vaughn, not even both. I bet they could've swung it for a package as paltry as Cease and Stiever, maybe having to toss in one of the high school righties they took last year to push that deal over the top.

But the Dodgers got him basically for free. They gave up nothing they give a shit about.

Verdugo is not nothing? He is pretty good young player

He's a brat. A ticking time bomb.

ok I guess I don't know much about the kid personality wise...what are you basing this on?


Verdugo would have been a platoon OF this year.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2020 5:44 pm 
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MongoMuller wrote:
312player wrote:
Anaheim still lacking pitching.


After the trade the Angels are the 4th best team in baseball according to FanGraphs. I see a lot of 7-5 wins this season. The starting pitching is improved with the additions of Ohtani, Stripling, Teheran, and Bundy but at best they're probably 15th in MLB. Ohtani has ace stuff, Stripling has some crazy metrics and Canning looks promising so the top half might be in good shape. The most important thing will be the starters getting thru 5 on a fairly consistent basis so the bullpen doesn't get blown out before June. The bullpen should be pretty good...Eppler has been stocking up on power arms.


Be a good team to trade Quintana to. I still think Oakland is the best team in that division.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 8:28 am 
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I certainly understand why you'd WANT to trade Quintana.....problem is....who starts in his place? That's a mighty thin starting pitcher list on the Cubs.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:43 pm 
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GoldenJet wrote:
The Angels are loading up.


They'll be better but they were horrific last year and their pitching staff still sucks. I also don't know if Pedersen is going to be controllable in the clubhouse either. We will see.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:45 pm 
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BigW72 wrote:
I certainly understand why you'd WANT to trade Quintana.....problem is....who starts in his place? That's a mighty thin starting pitcher list on the Cubs.



Who cares? Bring up two AAA arms to combine for 150 innings. This team isn't winning the division or getting a WC.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:49 pm 
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The Angels are what you get when you try to put together a roster with the best WAR. I dont think they'll make it to .500.


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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:52 pm 
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MongoMuller wrote:
312player wrote:
Anaheim still lacking pitching.


After the trade the Angels are the 4th best team in baseball according to FanGraphs. I see a lot of 7-5 wins this season. The starting pitching is improved with the additions of Ohtani, Stripling, Teheran, and Bundy but at best they're probably 15th in MLB. Ohtani has ace stuff, Stripling has some crazy metrics and Canning looks promising so the top half might be in good shape. The most important thing will be the starters getting thru 5 on a fairly consistent basis so the bullpen doesn't get blown out before June. The bullpen should be pretty good...Eppler has been stocking up on power arms.


Nah. Their pitching still stinks and Ohtani is a huge unknown still because he is pretty fragile as a starting pitcher. Then there is the question about whether he can play both in the field and on the mound. He certainly is an athletic freak and very talented but I think a smart pitcher can get him out pretty easy by busting him hard inside and getting him off of the plate and then change-ups and curves outside.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 8:06 pm 
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There have to be teams who are calling Boston and at least trying to beat the measly offer of Verdugo and Graterol.


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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 9:10 pm 
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Antarctica wrote:
There have to be teams who are calling Boston and at least trying to beat the measly offer of Verdugo and Graterol.


If they pass their physicals, it's a done deal, no?

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:24 pm 
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Minnesota has backed out and the trade as we knew it is definitively off. Betts is back on the market.


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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:32 pm 
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Antarctica wrote:
Minnesota has backed out and the trade as we knew it is definitively off. Betts is back on the market.


It'll still get done between the Dodgers and Red Sox I think.

Glad Maeda isn't going to the Twins.

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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2020 4:26 pm 
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I would say 50% Betts isn't traded, 25% someone else steps up with a real offer and swoops him and 25% the Dodgers break down and actually pay a price commensurate with a player of Betts' caliber.

The idea of them only needing to part with Kenta Maeda and Alex Verdugo to get maybe the best player in the game (call me when Trout wins a playoff game) is gladly dead. They should at least be forced to give up a single prospect in this deal. If not Lux then definitely May and Downs.


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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 5:59 pm 
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Back alive.


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 Post subject: Re: '19-'20 Offseason
PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:08 pm 
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