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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:21 pm 
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Regular Reader wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Brees has done more for New Orleans than a lot of his critics ever have for their own communities. Brees can be guilty of bad judgment and tone deafness here but it shouldn't erase everything he's ever done for that city. RR, don't you live down there? What's your perspective?


No, I live in a neighborhood here on the south side, parts of which were looted. I simply love New Orleans and the Saints. And I don't think that people down there or his teammates are unwilling to accept his apology or reject the good works he does and has been doing for well over a decade.


Oh my bad, idk why I thought you lived in NO :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:22 pm 
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Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Brees has done more for New Orleans than a lot of his critics ever have for their own communities. Brees can be guilty of bad judgment and tone deafness here but it shouldn't erase everything he's ever done for that city. RR, don't you live down there? What's your perspective?


I don't disagree with this, but to pretend that the criticisms of his statement aren't fair because "He did great things for a city" is ridiculous. He intentionally mischaracterized the kneeling and his peers called him out.

How do you know it was intentional? If it was intentional, he probably wouldn't have tweeted it.

I am glad LeBron ripped on him. Brees is clearly misinformed and not educated on the issue of the flag and its baggage.


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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:24 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Regular Reader wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Brees has done more for New Orleans than a lot of his critics ever have for their own communities. Brees can be guilty of bad judgment and tone deafness here but it shouldn't erase everything he's ever done for that city. RR, don't you live down there? What's your perspective?


No, I live in a neighborhood here on the south side, parts of which were looted. I simply love New Orleans and the Saints. And I don't think that people down there or his teammates are unwilling to accept his apology or reject the good works he does and has been doing for well over a decade.


Oh my bad, idk why I thought you lived in NO :lol:


I was surprised you thought so. RR has dropped plenty of hints at his location over the years.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:26 pm 
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Everyone knows that RR was a Bears fan until they screwed over Ditka and that's why he became a Saints fan when he went there.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:40 pm 
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tommy wrote:
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Brees has done more for New Orleans than a lot of his critics ever have for their own communities. Brees can be guilty of bad judgment and tone deafness here but it shouldn't erase everything he's ever done for that city. RR, don't you live down there? What's your perspective?


I don't disagree with this, but to pretend that the criticisms of his statement aren't fair because "He did great things for a city" is ridiculous. He intentionally mischaracterized the kneeling and his peers called him out.

How do you know it was intentional? If it was intentional, he probably wouldn't have tweeted it.

I am glad LeBron ripped on him. Brees is clearly misinformed and not educated on the issue of the flag and its baggage.


Because it's been explained publicly hundreds of times and I am sure his peers and teammates have had the conversation with him. There is no way that anyone who is paying attention or in that arena doesn't know.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:44 pm 
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Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Everyone knows that RR was a Bears fan until they screwed over Ditka and that's why he became a Saints fan when he went there.

I legitimately threw away every piece of Saints merchandise except for one jersey when they hired that clown. During that darkness I reverted back to general AFC fandom.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 3:20 pm 
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Nas wrote:
tommy wrote:
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Brees has done more for New Orleans than a lot of his critics ever have for their own communities. Brees can be guilty of bad judgment and tone deafness here but it shouldn't erase everything he's ever done for that city. RR, don't you live down there? What's your perspective?


I don't disagree with this, but to pretend that the criticisms of his statement aren't fair because "He did great things for a city" is ridiculous. He intentionally mischaracterized the kneeling and his peers called him out.

How do you know it was intentional? If it was intentional, he probably wouldn't have tweeted it.

I am glad LeBron ripped on him. Brees is clearly misinformed and not educated on the issue of the flag and its baggage.


Because it's been explained publicly hundreds of times and I am sure his peers and teammates have had the conversation with him. There is no way that anyone who is paying attention or in that arena doesn't know.

It's been explained? Sounds like a certain Bernstein fellow.

"Brees is being told to apologize profusely for having a different opinion. He is being told to limit his Twitter comments to football and to listen to the ex cathedra sources explaining the truth."


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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 3:31 pm 
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Regular Reader wrote:
Boilermaker Rick wrote:
Everyone knows that RR was a Bears fan until they screwed over Ditka and that's why he became a Saints fan when he went there.

I legitimately threw away every piece of Saints merchandise except for one jersey when they hired that clown. During that darkness I reverted back to general AFC fandom.

:lol: :lol:

I am a HUGE fan of New Orleans the city....but fuck Drew Brees and fuck the Saints.

HOWEVER, I don't blame anyone for being fed up with the Bears. It's a very tough team to remain loyal.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 3:39 pm 
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tommy wrote:
It's been explained? Sounds like a certain Bernstein fellow.

"Brees is being told to apologize profusely for having a different opinion. He is being told to limit his Twitter comments to football and to listen to the ex cathedra sources explaining the truth."


Yes, the reasons for kneeling have been explained hundreds of times if not more. None of the reasons had anything to do with the flag or military. Therefore, suggesting that they do is complete bullshit.

Brees wasn't criticized for having a different opinion, Brees was criticized for mischaracterizing the actions of others. I'm unsure why this is hard to understand.

As I mentioned earlier, players are often sitting, having conversations or doing a bunch of other shit during the anthem and the fans or their teammates don't give a shit. That's why Marshawn Lynch's non protesting sitting went unnoticed. That's why it took weeks and some pom pom waving before Kaepernick was noticed.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 3:43 pm 
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Nas wrote:
tommy wrote:
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Brees has done more for New Orleans than a lot of his critics ever have for their own communities. Brees can be guilty of bad judgment and tone deafness here but it shouldn't erase everything he's ever done for that city. RR, don't you live down there? What's your perspective?


I don't disagree with this, but to pretend that the criticisms of his statement aren't fair because "He did great things for a city" is ridiculous. He intentionally mischaracterized the kneeling and his peers called him out.

How do you know it was intentional? If it was intentional, he probably wouldn't have tweeted it.

I am glad LeBron ripped on him. Brees is clearly misinformed and not educated on the issue of the flag and its baggage.


Because it's been explained publicly hundreds of times and I am sure his peers and teammates have had the conversation with him. There is no way that anyone who is paying attention or in that arena doesn't know.


But Brees was pretty clear in stating that he was giving his subjective interpretation of the mass kneeling, an interpretation that is informed by his family history.

I therefore think it's awfully presumptuous to label his interpretation of the protest as an "intentional mischaracterization", especially since the flag holds many different meanings for people, and there are many different standards of conduct that are deemed acceptable with regards to this overdetermined symbol.

Additionally, Brees' teammates and their supporters are not justified in saying Brees' statements are wrong simply because they don't like them or he attributed a meaning to them that they didn't intend. Their gesture was symbolic--and symbols, after all, are always open to interpretation.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 3:46 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:10 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Nas wrote:
tommy wrote:
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Brees has done more for New Orleans than a lot of his critics ever have for their own communities. Brees can be guilty of bad judgment and tone deafness here but it shouldn't erase everything he's ever done for that city. RR, don't you live down there? What's your perspective?


I don't disagree with this, but to pretend that the criticisms of his statement aren't fair because "He did great things for a city" is ridiculous. He intentionally mischaracterized the kneeling and his peers called him out.

How do you know it was intentional? If it was intentional, he probably wouldn't have tweeted it.

I am glad LeBron ripped on him. Brees is clearly misinformed and not educated on the issue of the flag and its baggage.


Because it's been explained publicly hundreds of times and I am sure his peers and teammates have had the conversation with him. There is no way that anyone who is paying attention or in that arena doesn't know.


But Brees was pretty clear in stating that he was giving his subjective interpretation of the mass kneeling, an interpretation that is informed by his family history.

I therefore think it's awfully presumptuous to label his interpretation of the protest as an "intentional mischaracterization", especially since the flag holds many different meanings for people, and there are many different standards of conduct that are deemed acceptable with regards to this overdetermined symbol.

Additionally, Brees' teammates and their supporters are not justified in saying Brees' statements are wrong simply because they don't like them or he attributed a meaning to them that they didn't intend. Their gesture was symbolic--and symbols, after all, are always open to interpretation.


There's nothing to interpret for Brees. If I'm explicitly stating hundreds of times that my actions have absolutely nothing to do with our flag or military it is absolutely a mischaracterization to state that they do.

That mischaracterization was used by Trump and others to label the players as Un-American or worse. In an attempt to throw water on their cause. It's complete bullshit and it should be criticized.

Imagine if "Wear Pink", an attempt to raise funds and awareness for breast cancer, was "interpreted" as a promotion of homosexuality. Breast cancer organizations are saying that it's all about breast cancer awareness, but a Drew Brees believes it's an attempt to turn his son gay. Criticisms of Brees would be justified just like they are now.

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Last edited by Nas on Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:17 pm 
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Ok, so I guess if you are going to take a stand on this hyper-volatile issue, you really, really gotta couch it. And maybe run it through a peer review first, and then reassess, not caving in on your beliefs but making sure you are being fair and, as FF or Vegan Veganovich wrote, not "tone deaf."

I do feel that he was hammered back into place, though. Also, what Tall Midget said.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:21 pm 
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tommy wrote:
Ok, so I guess if you are going to take a stand on this hyper-volatile issue, you really, really gotta couch it. And maybe run it through a peer review first, and then reassess, not caving in on your beliefs but making sure you are being fair and, as FF or Vegan Veganovich wrote, not "tone deaf."

I do feel that he was hammered back into place, though. Also, what Tall Midget said.

"Language is inherently vague." --My first (and best) discourse analysis teacher

Michael Jordan was the gold standard when commenting on social issues

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:27 pm 
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Nas wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Nas wrote:
tommy wrote:
Nas wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Brees has done more for New Orleans than a lot of his critics ever have for their own communities. Brees can be guilty of bad judgment and tone deafness here but it shouldn't erase everything he's ever done for that city. RR, don't you live down there? What's your perspective?


I don't disagree with this, but to pretend that the criticisms of his statement aren't fair because "He did great things for a city" is ridiculous. He intentionally mischaracterized the kneeling and his peers called him out.

How do you know it was intentional? If it was intentional, he probably wouldn't have tweeted it.

I am glad LeBron ripped on him. Brees is clearly misinformed and not educated on the issue of the flag and its baggage.


Because it's been explained publicly hundreds of times and I am sure his peers and teammates have had the conversation with him. There is no way that anyone who is paying attention or in that arena doesn't know.


But Brees was pretty clear in stating that he was giving his subjective interpretation of the mass kneeling, an interpretation that is informed by his family history.

I therefore think it's awfully presumptuous to label his interpretation of the protest as an "intentional mischaracterization", especially since the flag holds many different meanings for people, and there are many different standards of conduct that are deemed acceptable with regards to this overdetermined symbol.

Additionally, Brees' teammates and their supporters are not justified in saying Brees' statements are wrong simply because they don't like them or he attributed a meaning to them that they didn't intend. Their gesture was symbolic--and symbols, after all, are always open to interpretation.


There's nothing to interpret for Brees. If I'm explicitly stating hundreds of times that my actions have absolutely nothing to do with our flag or military it is absolutely a mischaracterization to state that they do.

That mischaracterization was used by Trump and others to label the players as Un-American or worse. In an attempt to throw water on their cause. It's complete bullshit and it should be criticized.

Imagine if "Wear Pink", an attempt to raise funds and awareness for breast cancer, was "interpreted" as a promotion of homosexuality. Breast cancer organizations are saying that it's all about breast cancer awareness, but a Drew Brees believes it's an attempt to turn his son gay. Criticisms of Brees would be justified just like they are now.


This statement doesn't reflect an understanding that the national anthem and American flag have different meanings for different people. By drawing these symbols into their protests, the protesters were opening their actions to interpretations governed by divergent understandings of history, social relations and national identity. The fact that many protesters have rejected Brees' view doesn't make Brees wrong. Rather, it simply reflects their narrow understanding of American iconography.

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Last edited by Tall Midget on Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:31 pm 
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tommy wrote:
Ok, so I guess if you are going to take a stand on this hyper-volatile issue, you really, really gotta couch it. And maybe run it through a peer review first, and then reassess, not caving in on your beliefs but making sure you are being fair and, as FF or Vegan Veganovich wrote, not "tone deaf."

I don't use the phrase tone deaf. Probably someone lame like Vegan

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:11 pm 
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It's been reported and I vaguely remember him kneeling at least once. In London of all places.

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:16 pm 
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Regular Reader wrote:
It's been reported and I vaguely remember him kneeling at least once. In London of all places.

Photographic evidence exists and has been posted here on the CFMB.


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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2020 8:15 pm 
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Soon, anyone with an unpopular opinion will be forced to submit a formal apology to a group of woke authorities who will decide whether the apology is good enough. Steep penalties for any that are determined to be insincere.


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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 8:28 am 
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2nd apology

Quote:
“I know there’s not much I can say that would make things better right now, but I just want you to see in my eyes how sorry I am for the comments I made yesterday,” Brees said. “I am sorry, and I will do better, and I will be part of the solution, and I am your ally.”

Teammates indicated that they accepted Brees’s apology, but this issue likely won’t go away, and the national anthem before the Saints’ first game will be watched closely, for what Brees does and what his teammates do.


The man is going to kneel.


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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 8:54 am 
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Brees is already a pandering bag of shit for apologizing so anything he does from now on really doesn’t matter . Not like he can sell out his principles any further .

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 8:55 am 
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storkinastorm wrote:
Soon, anyone with an unpopular opinion will be forced to submit a formal apology to a group of woke authorities who will decide whether the apology is good enough. Steep penalties for any that are determined to be insincere.

Can you apologize for being a homo?

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 9:26 am 
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storkinastorm wrote:
Soon, anyone with an unpopular opinion will be forced to submit a formal apology to a group of woke authorities who will decide whether the apology is good enough. Steep penalties for any that are determined to be insincere.

Image

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 9:45 am 
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It's been reported and I vaguely remember him kneeling at least once. In London of all places.

Nas?

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 9:50 am 
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Furious Styles wrote:
Regular Reader wrote:
It's been reported and I vaguely remember him kneeling at least once. In London of all places.

Nas?

When the queen knighted him .

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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 9:55 am 
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storkinastorm wrote:
Soon, anyone with an unpopular opinion will be forced to submit a formal apology to a group of woke authorities who will decide whether the apology is good enough. Steep penalties for any that are determined to be insincere.

Image

It's concerning someone as respected as Brees feels he has to grovel. And he IS groveling.


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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 10:01 am 
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If you guys think you can fight this you're wrong. Indulge it, let it play out on its own terms. Of course this zany leftism is doomed to fail.

You're going to need to give up everything if you want to see things ever improve.


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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 10:01 am 
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FavreFan wrote:
storkinastorm wrote:
Soon, anyone with an unpopular opinion will be forced to submit a formal apology to a group of woke authorities who will decide whether the apology is good enough. Steep penalties for any that are determined to be insincere.

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A "libertarian" everybody!


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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 10:11 am 
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FF is right. Being whinier burritos than the leftists isn't the path to victory.

Of course we know these identity politics obsessed people are totally wrong. Its obvious to anyone with a functioning brain that BLM are more race-obsessed and bigoted than anyone else. But if you think you're gonna get anywhere trying to make that point in this day and age you're wrong. It just sounds bitter. But times do change, and eventually people will look back on these movements and the silly things people did because of them and question it. The same way we question people of the past now. It sucks to know the next fifteen or so years will be terrible, that the attitude of the people in power after Trump will be reprisal and revenge against white people. But whatever, just take it on the chin and move on.

The real shame is that the USA is going to let China rise unabated. The only power capable of standing up to them alone is collapsing internally which means its up to Japan, Australia, Taiwan, India etc. to hold the line. If you want to make a difference and not live in America I'm sure you'll find plenty of enlistment opportunities for those countries in the coming years.


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 Post subject: Re: The Drew Brees hate
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2020 10:24 am 
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Identity politics represents the best chance neoliberalism has of surviving. It is a reformist movement designed to save the system from itself. If identity politics fail, so too will neoliberalism.

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