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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 6:31 pm 
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How was Lamar Campbell outed as the snitch? What did he leak?

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 6:50 pm 
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Warren Newson wrote:
Aren't we getting a little carried away here? I know there's an element of people working out frustrations in these posts and just having some fun at George's expense, but good God, it could have been a lot worse. Nagy could still be here, Pace could still be here, they could be trying to do all of this themselves, or they could be using outside help without legitimate NFL credentials.

Yes, it's a similar process to the one they used last time, but at some point some non football person in the organization is going to have to hire a football person. I don't think it matters too much if that initial football person that gets hired is a president of football operations or a general manager. Winning or losing a press conference also doesn't equate to winning or losing any games.

I'll reserve my disdain until I see who they hire.


I think the point is they doubled down on not holding themselves accountable for running a mediocre to bad organization in a premier city. So the same structure responsible for being mediocre hasn't been reshaped in any meaningful way. I'm sure you know what the casual definition of insanity is.

Phillips is not well regarded around the league yet they insist on giving him say in this process. His presence alone is likely to repel well regarded and serious candidates for both roles because of the ambiguity surrounding his influence on the football side. We also don't know if Phillips will steer the choice toward younger candidates who are unlikely to quickly blossom into executives who will tell Phillips to mind his own business. This is why I don't think someone like Harbaugh is coming because his first order of business will be/should be to lock Phillips in his office and throw away the key. Phillips has motive for ensuring the candidate is not a threat to his position.

So that is the real loss of today.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 8:08 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Warren Newson wrote:
Aren't we getting a little carried away here? I know there's an element of people working out frustrations in these posts and just having some fun at George's expense, but good God, it could have been a lot worse. Nagy could still be here, Pace could still be here, they could be trying to do all of this themselves, or they could be using outside help without legitimate NFL credentials.

Yes, it's a similar process to the one they used last time, but at some point some non football person in the organization is going to have to hire a football person. I don't think it matters too much if that initial football person that gets hired is a president of football operations or a general manager. Winning or losing a press conference also doesn't equate to winning or losing any games.

I'll reserve my disdain until I see who they hire.


I think the point is they doubled down on not holding themselves accountable for running a mediocre to bad organization in a premier city. So the same structure responsible for being mediocre hasn't been reshaped in any meaningful way. I'm sure you know what the casual definition of insanity is.

Phillips is not well regarded around the league yet they insist on giving him say in this process. His presence alone is likely to repel well regarded and serious candidates for both roles because of the ambiguity surrounding his influence on the football side. We also don't know if Phillips will steer the choice toward younger candidates who are unlikely to quickly blossom into executives who will tell Phillips to mind his own business. This is why I don't think someone like Harbaugh is coming because his first order of business will be/should be to lock Phillips in his office and throw away the key. Phillips has motive for ensuring the candidate is not a threat to his position.

So that is the real loss of today.


I think your concerns are well-founded, but do you think George would make a better decision than Phillips? If they hired some other non football guy to hire the initial football guy, do you think he would necessarily make a better decision than Phillips?

What I suppose I'm saying is that there is an element of dumb luck in finding the right GM, HC, or QB. There might be teams out there that have a better process for finding these people than the Bears, but those processes are also based in large part on dumb luck. If there was a sure fire process to find a good GM or HC everybody would just follow that process and there would be no mystery. All you can do is just cross your fingers and hope they find someone with good judgment and good intuition.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 8:39 pm 
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Warren Newson wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Warren Newson wrote:
Aren't we getting a little carried away here? I know there's an element of people working out frustrations in these posts and just having some fun at George's expense, but good God, it could have been a lot worse. Nagy could still be here, Pace could still be here, they could be trying to do all of this themselves, or they could be using outside help without legitimate NFL credentials.

Yes, it's a similar process to the one they used last time, but at some point some non football person in the organization is going to have to hire a football person. I don't think it matters too much if that initial football person that gets hired is a president of football operations or a general manager. Winning or losing a press conference also doesn't equate to winning or losing any games.

I'll reserve my disdain until I see who they hire.


I think the point is they doubled down on not holding themselves accountable for running a mediocre to bad organization in a premier city. So the same structure responsible for being mediocre hasn't been reshaped in any meaningful way. I'm sure you know what the casual definition of insanity is.

Phillips is not well regarded around the league yet they insist on giving him say in this process. His presence alone is likely to repel well regarded and serious candidates for both roles because of the ambiguity surrounding his influence on the football side. We also don't know if Phillips will steer the choice toward younger candidates who are unlikely to quickly blossom into executives who will tell Phillips to mind his own business. This is why I don't think someone like Harbaugh is coming because his first order of business will be/should be to lock Phillips in his office and throw away the key. Phillips has motive for ensuring the candidate is not a threat to his position.

So that is the real loss of today.


I think your concerns are well-founded, but do you think George would make a better decision than Phillips? If they hired some other non football guy to hire the initial football guy, do you think he would necessarily make a better decision than Phillips?

What I suppose I'm saying is that there is an element of dumb luck in finding the right GM, HC, or QB. There might be teams out there that have a better process for finding these people than the Bears, but those processes are also based in large part on dumb luck. If there was a sure fire process to find a good GM or HC everybody would just follow that process and there would be no mystery. All you can do is just cross your fingers and hope they find someone with good judgment and good intuition.

That would imply that all organizations are pretty much equal and that some have just been lucky. I doubt you actually believe that.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 8:44 pm 
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All that matters is the QB position. Even great coaches fail without a good QB. And other areas of strength - be it defense, run game, etc. - typically can’t last more than a few years without a great QB.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 8:57 pm 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Warren Newson wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Warren Newson wrote:
Aren't we getting a little carried away here? I know there's an element of people working out frustrations in these posts and just having some fun at George's expense, but good God, it could have been a lot worse. Nagy could still be here, Pace could still be here, they could be trying to do all of this themselves, or they could be using outside help without legitimate NFL credentials.

Yes, it's a similar process to the one they used last time, but at some point some non football person in the organization is going to have to hire a football person. I don't think it matters too much if that initial football person that gets hired is a president of football operations or a general manager. Winning or losing a press conference also doesn't equate to winning or losing any games.

I'll reserve my disdain until I see who they hire.


I think the point is they doubled down on not holding themselves accountable for running a mediocre to bad organization in a premier city. So the same structure responsible for being mediocre hasn't been reshaped in any meaningful way. I'm sure you know what the casual definition of insanity is.

Phillips is not well regarded around the league yet they insist on giving him say in this process. His presence alone is likely to repel well regarded and serious candidates for both roles because of the ambiguity surrounding his influence on the football side. We also don't know if Phillips will steer the choice toward younger candidates who are unlikely to quickly blossom into executives who will tell Phillips to mind his own business. This is why I don't think someone like Harbaugh is coming because his first order of business will be/should be to lock Phillips in his office and throw away the key. Phillips has motive for ensuring the candidate is not a threat to his position.

So that is the real loss of today.


I think your concerns are well-founded, but do you think George would make a better decision than Phillips? If they hired some other non football guy to hire the initial football guy, do you think he would necessarily make a better decision than Phillips?

What I suppose I'm saying is that there is an element of dumb luck in finding the right GM, HC, or QB. There might be teams out there that have a better process for finding these people than the Bears, but those processes are also based in large part on dumb luck. If there was a sure fire process to find a good GM or HC everybody would just follow that process and there would be no mystery. All you can do is just cross your fingers and hope they find someone with good judgment and good intuition.

That would imply that all organizations are pretty much equal and that some have just been lucky. I doubt you actually believe that.


I think that by talking to someone who has had some NFL success and is well respected (Bill Polian), they are more or less following the same process that a successful team might follow. If they repeat that process enough times they will eventually find a good GM. Conversely, if successful teams were asked to hire three GM's over a 15 to 20 year period (like the Bears have), at least one of those GM's wouldn't be very good.

To Antioch's point, a good QB makes everyone look smart and competent.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 9:00 pm 
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Warren Newson wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Warren Newson wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Warren Newson wrote:
Aren't we getting a little carried away here? I know there's an element of people working out frustrations in these posts and just having some fun at George's expense, but good God, it could have been a lot worse. Nagy could still be here, Pace could still be here, they could be trying to do all of this themselves, or they could be using outside help without legitimate NFL credentials.

Yes, it's a similar process to the one they used last time, but at some point some non football person in the organization is going to have to hire a football person. I don't think it matters too much if that initial football person that gets hired is a president of football operations or a general manager. Winning or losing a press conference also doesn't equate to winning or losing any games.

I'll reserve my disdain until I see who they hire.


I think the point is they doubled down on not holding themselves accountable for running a mediocre to bad organization in a premier city. So the same structure responsible for being mediocre hasn't been reshaped in any meaningful way. I'm sure you know what the casual definition of insanity is.

Phillips is not well regarded around the league yet they insist on giving him say in this process. His presence alone is likely to repel well regarded and serious candidates for both roles because of the ambiguity surrounding his influence on the football side. We also don't know if Phillips will steer the choice toward younger candidates who are unlikely to quickly blossom into executives who will tell Phillips to mind his own business. This is why I don't think someone like Harbaugh is coming because his first order of business will be/should be to lock Phillips in his office and throw away the key. Phillips has motive for ensuring the candidate is not a threat to his position.

So that is the real loss of today.


I think your concerns are well-founded, but do you think George would make a better decision than Phillips? If they hired some other non football guy to hire the initial football guy, do you think he would necessarily make a better decision than Phillips?

What I suppose I'm saying is that there is an element of dumb luck in finding the right GM, HC, or QB. There might be teams out there that have a better process for finding these people than the Bears, but those processes are also based in large part on dumb luck. If there was a sure fire process to find a good GM or HC everybody would just follow that process and there would be no mystery. All you can do is just cross your fingers and hope they find someone with good judgment and good intuition.

That would imply that all organizations are pretty much equal and that some have just been lucky. I doubt you actually believe that.


I think that by talking to someone who has had some NFL success and is well respected (Bill Polian), they are more or less following the same process that a successful team might follow. If they repeat that process enough times they will eventually find a good GM. Conversely, if successful teams were asked to hire three GM's over a 15 to 20 year period (like the Bears have), at least one of those GM's wouldn't be very good.

To Antioch's point, a good QB makes everyone look smart and competent.

We can all agree on that last sentence but the rest is sort of a circular argument which ignores history.

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Last edited by Zippy-The-Pinhead on Mon Jan 10, 2022 9:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 9:01 pm 
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Talking to someone who is familiar with today's game makes more sense than a guy who is a dinosaur. The game has passed Polian by. Obviously, I pray that they get it right.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 9:03 pm 
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Nas wrote:
Talking to someone who is familiar with today's game makes more sense than a guy who is a dinosaur. The game has passed Polian by. Obviously, I pray that they get it right.

This too.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 9:08 pm 
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There is something to the idea that the teams that have great GM and coaches don’t have much practice in hiring them. Great teams would keep the ones they have like Patriots. So whether you are the Bears, Rams, Lions or 49ers there has to be so element of luck over the last 15-20 years to make the big hire.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 9:16 pm 
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Warren Newson wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Warren Newson wrote:
Aren't we getting a little carried away here? I know there's an element of people working out frustrations in these posts and just having some fun at George's expense, but good God, it could have been a lot worse. Nagy could still be here, Pace could still be here, they could be trying to do all of this themselves, or they could be using outside help without legitimate NFL credentials.

Yes, it's a similar process to the one they used last time, but at some point some non football person in the organization is going to have to hire a football person. I don't think it matters too much if that initial football person that gets hired is a president of football operations or a general manager. Winning or losing a press conference also doesn't equate to winning or losing any games.

I'll reserve my disdain until I see who they hire.


I think the point is they doubled down on not holding themselves accountable for running a mediocre to bad organization in a premier city. So the same structure responsible for being mediocre hasn't been reshaped in any meaningful way. I'm sure you know what the casual definition of insanity is.

Phillips is not well regarded around the league yet they insist on giving him say in this process. His presence alone is likely to repel well regarded and serious candidates for both roles because of the ambiguity surrounding his influence on the football side. We also don't know if Phillips will steer the choice toward younger candidates who are unlikely to quickly blossom into executives who will tell Phillips to mind his own business. This is why I don't think someone like Harbaugh is coming because his first order of business will be/should be to lock Phillips in his office and throw away the key. Phillips has motive for ensuring the candidate is not a threat to his position.

So that is the real loss of today.


I think your concerns are well-founded, but do you think George would make a better decision than Phillips? If they hired some other non football guy to hire the initial football guy, do you think he would necessarily make a better decision than Phillips?

What I suppose I'm saying is that there is an element of dumb luck in finding the right GM, HC, or QB. There might be teams out there that have a better process for finding these people than the Bears, but those processes are also based in large part on dumb luck. If there was a sure fire process to find a good GM or HC everybody would just follow that process and there would be no mystery. All you can do is just cross your fingers and hope they find someone with good judgment and good intuition.


I get what you're saying. Here's the frustrating part - all the Bears had to do today is say this: we've hired Bill Polian as VP of Football Ops.His mandate is to find the next GM and HC for this team. Please direct your questions about the GM and coach search to him after he wakes from his nap.

That's really it. Instead what you get is this: so we've got football guy and then we've got me and Ted. Ted and me don't really know football so that's why we've got football guy, but me and Ted are gonna run the search and make the decision after football guy tells us what to do.

So you can see why the second scenario, which is what actually happened, makes no sense and all and doesn't portend well for the future, just like it hasn't most of the time this has been done before.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2022 9:30 pm 
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You guys keep forgetting the one common rotted flower denominator.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 10:59 am 
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:00 am 
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Nas wrote:
How was Lamar Campbell outed as the snitch? What did he leak?


Hopefully, someone can answer this question.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:16 am 
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Phillips is a POC. I'm surprised they didn't consolidate that department under him as well.

Somehow, Ted is in charge of everything

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:19 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
Phillips is a POC. I'm surprised they didn't consolidate that department under him as well.

Somehow, Ted is in charge of everything


He's either the de facto owner or a shield of the McCaskey family.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:21 am 
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Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Phillips is a POC. I'm surprised they didn't consolidate that department under him as well.

Somehow, Ted is in charge of everything


He's either the de facto owner or a shield of the McCaskey family.


It's such a bizarre situation, like the team is held in trust with him as the trustee. The Mcclaskey's are absolutely spellbound by him

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:25 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Phillips is a POC. I'm surprised they didn't consolidate that department under him as well.

Somehow, Ted is in charge of everything


He's either the de facto owner or a shield of the McCaskey family.


It's such a bizarre situation, like the team is held in trust with him as the trustee. The Mcclaskey's are absolutely spellbound by him


It wouldn't be shocking if Phillips somehow masterminded the McGinnis debacle, knowing Michael would be humiliated and launched and Phillips would be promoted. Clearly Phillips by now knows all the skeletons in the family.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:42 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
Phillips is a POC. I'm surprised they didn't consolidate that department under him as well.

Somehow, Ted is in charge of everything


He's either the de facto owner or a shield of the McCaskey family.


It's such a bizarre situation, like the team is held in trust with him as the trustee. The Mcclaskey's are absolutely spellbound by him

and it's clear to anyone outside the McCaskey family that Phillips is an absolute moron.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:44 am 
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Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Nas wrote:
Talking to someone who is familiar with today's game makes more sense than a guy who is a dinosaur. The game has passed Polian by. Obviously, I pray that they get it right.

This too.



Football is an amazingly simple game.

Look at how successful the Packers have been since they went back to mixing pass/run in a game plan.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:51 am 
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Seacrest wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Nas wrote:
Talking to someone who is familiar with today's game makes more sense than a guy who is a dinosaur. The game has passed Polian by. Obviously, I pray that they get it right.

This too.



Football is an amazingly simple game.

Look at how successful the Packers have been since they went back to mixing pass/run in a game plan.


All things are easier when you have the best WR in football and a top 10 of all time quarterback.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:53 am 
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Nas wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Nas wrote:
Talking to someone who is familiar with today's game makes more sense than a guy who is a dinosaur. The game has passed Polian by. Obviously, I pray that they get it right.

This too.



Football is an amazingly simple game.

Look at how successful the Packers have been since they went back to mixing pass/run in a game plan.


All things are easier when you have the best WR in football and a top 10 of all time quarterback.


Polian also built the Buffalo Super Bowl teams.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:55 am 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Nas wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Nas wrote:
Talking to someone who is familiar with today's game makes more sense than a guy who is a dinosaur. The game has passed Polian by. Obviously, I pray that they get it right.

This too.



Football is an amazingly simple game.

Look at how successful the Packers have been since they went back to mixing pass/run in a game plan.


All things are easier when you have the best WR in football and a top 10 of all time quarterback.


Polian also built the Buffalo Super Bowl teams.


If this was 2002, I would love to have him in the room. I'm afraid that the game has passed him by. He's also been out of the arena too long. Hopefully, I'm dead wrong.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:59 am 
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Nas wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Nas wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Nas wrote:
Talking to someone who is familiar with today's game makes more sense than a guy who is a dinosaur. The game has passed Polian by. Obviously, I pray that they get it right.

This too.



Football is an amazingly simple game.

Look at how successful the Packers have been since they went back to mixing pass/run in a game plan.


All things are easier when you have the best WR in football and a top 10 of all time quarterback.


Polian also built the Buffalo Super Bowl teams.


If this was 2002, I would love to have him in the room. I'm afraid that the game has passed him by. He's also been out of the arena too long. Hopefully, I'm dead wrong.


I agree that he seems disconnected from the contemporary NFL. I wouldn't want him as the sole football thinker on a search committee for the GM and head coach of an NFL franchise.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 1:31 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Nas wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
Zippy-The-Pinhead wrote:
Nas wrote:
Talking to someone who is familiar with today's game makes more sense than a guy who is a dinosaur. The game has passed Polian by. Obviously, I pray that they get it right.

This too.



Football is an amazingly simple game.

Look at how successful the Packers have been since they went back to mixing pass/run in a game plan.


All things are easier when you have the best WR in football and a top 10 of all time quarterback.


Polian also built the Buffalo Super Bowl teams.

The teams that lost 4 straight super Bowls including one to the Giants that they were favored to win?

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2022 3:05 pm 
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I think the Bears have enough talent to be a fringe playoff team but would not belong on the field with any of these teams in the second week

lots of work to do

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 24, 2022 3:10 pm 
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good dolphin wrote:
I think the Bears have enough talent to be a fringe playoff team but would not belong on the field with any of these teams in the second week

lots of work to do


It all depends on Fields. Can he be great. If not the futility will continue.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 9:02 am 
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I have full faith in the Bears executive search team to mess this up entirely.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 9:05 am 
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good dolphin wrote:
I have full faith in the Bears executive search team to mess this up entirely.

It certainly seems that way. Everyone seems to be waiting on what Harbaugh is doing but it really doesn't make sense how you can be interviewing coaches and GMs at the same time. I would think you would have hired a GM within a week of them being fired so they can be in the interview.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 9:57 am 
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Brick wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
I have full faith in the Bears executive search team to mess this up entirely.

It certainly seems that way. Everyone seems to be waiting on what Harbaugh is doing but it really doesn't make sense how you can be interviewing coaches and GMs at the same time. I would think you would have hired a GM within a week of them being fired so they can be in the interview.


They decided to bring Nagy and Pace back at the end of last year after some consideration, knowing a bad season was likely going to mean the end for both. A reasonable executive would have been preparing a short list of GM candidates for the past 12 months.

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