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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 7:25 am 
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Remember when DK Metcalf and hundreds of other players demanded a trade and ended up signing new contracts and didn’t get traded. Sure, he can still be traded and it’s something to talk about and all, but it could be a nothingburger.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 7:30 am 
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KDdidit wrote:
Remember when DK Metcalf and hundreds of other players demanded a trade and ended up signing new contracts and didn’t get traded. Sure, he can still be traded and it’s something to talk about and all, but it could be a nothingburger.


Not having an agent changes everything with Roquan

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 7:51 am 
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Seacrest wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
Remember when DK Metcalf and hundreds of other players demanded a trade and ended up signing new contracts and didn’t get traded. Sure, he can still be traded and it’s something to talk about and all, but it could be a nothingburger.


Not having an agent changes everything with Roquan


Roquan seems like a pretty "unusual" guy.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 8:59 am 
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If someone offers you a first rounder for Smith you take it. His defensive rankings make perfect sense, he is good in coverage, but gets overpowered in the run game, also drifts in some games and has missed significant time with mysterious mental issues which easily could happen again. It's more of a question about if you want to slot that type of cap room for 5 years toward a guy whose game is totally dependent on speed, how will that look in 3 years when the team might be good?

The fact that he represents himself and has a history of mental issues is very concerning because it does seem that part of the negotiation process in pro sports is for the team to throw all kinds of negative stuff into negotiations in order to argue for a lower salary, the agents protect the players from that and argue for the player, Smith likely will take the negative stuff personally and that would certainly impact his ability to rationally negotiate.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 10:02 am 
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Smith has been increasingly ineffective against play action over the past 2-3 years, and at least one evaluation system has him ranked below average in that facet of the game. That's not a good sign given that the NFL has become a play action league.

Didn't Ian Rapoport say that Roquan would yield at least a first-rounder in trade? If another team offers a first + a third or something similar, I don't see how Poles could pass that up. Contrary to Rapoport's opinion, Roquan is only sporadically a "game-changing" player.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 10:55 am 
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At this stage, I don't think any team will give up a first rounder...they don't have to.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 11:00 am 
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BigW72 wrote:
At this stage, I don't think any team will give up a first rounder...they don't have to.


I'm not sure what you mean. The Bears don't have to trade Roquan. If he wants to sit, let him. I'd also take him off the PUP list today.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 12:50 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
BigW72 wrote:
At this stage, I don't think any team will give up a first rounder...they don't have to.


I'm not sure what you mean. The Bears don't have to trade Roquan. If he wants to sit, let him. I'd also take him off the PUP list today.

This. It isn't the NBA where you can dog your way out. In football, it really hurts you to do that.

He should show up today hell bent on having a career year.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:01 pm 
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Agreed they don't have to trade him, but he's not going to figure into their future plans. They should have known that and dealt him already.

I'm just saying I don't see a team coming up and offering a 1st rounder. He's a good player selectively, but not as special as he thinks he is.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:04 pm 
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Nardi wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
The Bears don't have to trade Roquan. If he wants to sit, let him. I'd also take him off the PUP list today.

This. It isn't the NBA where you can dog your way out. In football, it really hurts you to do that.
Agree 100%


Poles should tell him something to the effect of, "We'll do our best to work out a trade for you. As of now, you have to report because you're off the PUP list. If you want to hold out, go ahead. If you want to half ass it on the field, go ahead. Keep in mind that all of our potential trade partners will either see you holding out or see your performance at practice. We aren't taking a 6th round pick just to please you. And if we have to franchise you next year, we will."

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:33 pm 
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Got your wish Midge, off of the PUP list.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 4:04 pm 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Seacrest wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
Remember when DK Metcalf and hundreds of other players demanded a trade and ended up signing new contracts and didn’t get traded. Sure, he can still be traded and it’s something to talk about and all, but it could be a nothingburger.


Not having an agent changes everything with Roquan


Roquan seems like a pretty "unusual" guy.


Agreed.

Hence the back loaded contract I think.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 7:04 pm 
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Clawmaster wrote:
If someone offers you a first rounder for Smith you take it. His defensive rankings make perfect sense, he is good in coverage, but gets overpowered in the run game, also drifts in some games and has missed significant time with mysterious mental issues which easily could happen again. It's more of a question about if you want to slot that type of cap room for 5 years toward a guy whose game is totally dependent on speed, how will that look in 3 years when the team might be good?

The fact that he represents himself and has a history of mental issues is very concerning because it does seem that part of the negotiation process in pro sports is for the team to throw all kinds of negative stuff into negotiations in order to argue for a lower salary, the agents protect the players from that and argue for the player, Smith likely will take the negative stuff personally and that would certainly impact his ability to rationally negotiate.


I've always thought he was terrible against the pass. Maybe my eyes are lying to me, but any TE who isn't running in quicksand appears to beat him.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 7:48 pm 
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Nas wrote:
Clawmaster wrote:
If someone offers you a first rounder for Smith you take it. His defensive rankings make perfect sense, he is good in coverage, but gets overpowered in the run game, also drifts in some games and has missed significant time with mysterious mental issues which easily could happen again. It's more of a question about if you want to slot that type of cap room for 5 years toward a guy whose game is totally dependent on speed, how will that look in 3 years when the team might be good?

The fact that he represents himself and has a history of mental issues is very concerning because it does seem that part of the negotiation process in pro sports is for the team to throw all kinds of negative stuff into negotiations in order to argue for a lower salary, the agents protect the players from that and argue for the player, Smith likely will take the negative stuff personally and that would certainly impact his ability to rationally negotiate.


I've always thought he was terrible against the pass. Maybe my eyes are lying to me, but any TE who isn't running in quicksand appears to beat him.



I think this is what Midge was referring when he referenced his struggles with play action.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 10:51 am 
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Roquan apparently is a no-show at practice. Let the fines begin!




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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 10:53 am 
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This is like a toxic marriage, it always has been with him and The Bears, remember as a rookie he held out for stupid ass reasons, it just needs to end in a divorce. Throw in some good seasons in between but you had off the field drama, a car crash, , he needs to go away.

He's not a franchise QB, or a guy that sacks franchise QB at an elite level, or an elite playmaker at WR, so we can live without him.


Last edited by Caller Bob on Thu Aug 11, 2022 10:59 am, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 10:56 am 
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Yeah, I don't see them patching this up. He went scorched earth.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 11:01 am 
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Plot twist: Roquan Smith just walked out of the training room with David Montgomery and Angelo Blackson. So he *is* here at practice, just not practicing.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 11:11 am 
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No fines for Roquan, then. Too bad.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 11:23 am 
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Plot twist or bad reporting?

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 12:07 pm 
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If I'm Roquan and my coach is saying this...


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“You have to ask him,” — Bears coach Matt Eberflus on why LB Roquan Smith didn’t practice. He expects all healthy players to participate. Smith, now off PUP, did not.


I say, "I have no idea why they put me on PUP to begin with. I was never injured."

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 3:07 pm 
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He wasn’t holding out for stupid ass reasons his rookie year. Bears management was trying to put provisions in his contract to screw him over on guaranteed money if he got suspended a game for any helmet to helmet hits that season, even though he had no prior issues with it. Eventually they came to a compromise that any suspension totaling 3 games would trigger it.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 3:10 pm 
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KDdidit wrote:
He wasn’t holding out for stupid ass reasons his rookie year. Bears management was trying to put provisions in his contract to screw him over on guaranteed money if he got suspended a game for any helmet to helmet hits that season, even though he had no prior issues with it. Eventually they came to a compromise that any suspension totaling 3 games would trigger it.


I had forgotten about that strange clause. Was that a thing with any other team or just the forward-thinking Bears? Just like asking Bruce Arians to do a mock press conference.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 3:21 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
KDdidit wrote:
He wasn’t holding out for stupid ass reasons his rookie year. Bears management was trying to put provisions in his contract to screw him over on guaranteed money if he got suspended a game for any helmet to helmet hits that season, even though he had no prior issues with it. Eventually they came to a compromise that any suspension totaling 3 games would trigger it.


I had forgotten about that strange clause. Was that a thing with any other team or just the forward-thinking Bears? Just like asking Bruce Arians to do a mock press conference.


I remembered it vaguely correctly

Quote:

At some point in July, the Bears caved to that initial request, according to David Haugh of the Chicago Tribune, agreeing to tailor the language in Smith’s contract to protect his guaranteed money in the event of an illegal-hit suspension. (The Bears are not alone in this; the Bills, Jets and Giants have all made similar compromises in contracts regarding the helmet rule this season.) But after that agreement, the holdout continued over language regarding protection from losing guaranteed money in the event of a suspension for on-field behavior, like getting into a fight or arguing with officials.

Smith does not have a history of any on-field behavior infractions, so this seemed to be a standoff to set a precedent for both sides—the Bears for future players and CAA for future deals and clients. Haugh reported that only four teams in the league have written contracts with protections as far as what Smith sought. CAA also represents Sam Darnold, who held out from Jets camp for three days, and Chargers defensive end Joey Bosa, who held out for 31 days in 2016.

It’s not clear yet whether it was the Bears or Smith’s camp who initiated the compromise. As reported by Mike Florio of Pro Football Talk, Smith’s guarantees are only voided if he’s suspended by the NFL for three or more games for anything that happens during a play (this has only happened to one player—Vontaze Burfict—in the last decade). If Smith is punished for something happening after a play, the rookie’s guarantees will void only if he’s determined to be the aggragator of the situation or if he’s suspended two games or more.



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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 6:22 pm 
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How involved do agents typically get in trade talks? Bernstein suggested that Poles should tell Roquan to go out himself and find a trade if he wants one. LoHo then said Roquan (who has no agent) should send a DM to Jerry Jones, telling him he's available. :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 6:33 pm 
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Let him get high in Green Bay with Aaron Rodgers.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 6:49 pm 
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my guess is its too close to season start and roquan hasnt showed anything spectacular in his career yet, so he doesnt have the offer hes looking for. whats funny is he might actually have that offer if he had a fucking agent.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 6:51 pm 
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Jaw Breaker wrote:
How involved do agents typically get in trade talks? Bernstein suggested that Poles should tell Roquan to go out himself and find a trade if he wants one. LoHo then said Roquan (who has no agent) should send a DM to Jerry Jones, telling him he's available. :lol:


Very.

And Poles is too smart to take up lil Danny on that thought.

If he had an agent, they could be quietly shopping a trade.

But since he does not, Roquan can't make those calls without breaking league rules.

Poles is holding the cards here.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 8:31 pm 
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Yea that's what I mean hes waiting for a team to call and woo him and I don't think it will happen this late in the off-season.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2022 10:17 pm 
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Just trade his ass.

Don't get me wrong. He's good. I like him. But we're gonna suck for the next 2 years with or without him. He's at a position where he's not a huge difference maker.

People say you can get a first for him. I don't think so.

But I would take a 2nd and a 4th.

Bank the money you would have paid him for when you are ready to win. Then go grab somebody like him at that point.


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