Just to recap -

The Sox season was succesful because Frank didn't think they would make the playoffs, but in the end they did.

The Cubs season was a failure in Frank's eyes - even though they met the EXACT SAME CRITERIA as the Sox did.


Lay off the household cleaners, big boy. They will kill all three of those brain cells you're trying to keep.

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Well spanky, I guess I can't polish a turd.


The Sox season was a success because they were 72-90 last season and were expected to be better, but certainly not good enough to contend for the division. Especially with the moves the Tigers made. Sox played well, overcame key injuries down the stretch, and won thier division by beating 3 different teams in 3 different days. Going from worst to first in back to back seasons is a success.

The Cubs season was a failure because they were coming off a division championship, were clearly the best team in the NL Central, and were expected to coast to a division crown, which they basically did. They were then the odds on favorite to win the NL pennant, and were heavily favored against the Dodgers. They failed to win a single game against them.

Those are facts. Deny if you wish. Insult me if you wish, I really don't give a shit. Facts are facts and you clearly on on the wrong side of this debate.

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success?

failure?

pressure?

momentum?

Yeah...argue that because I'm sure there is clear and concise conclusion to be found. Bernstein can use this "fodder" the entire off season to continue to stir up the meatballs...as I'm sure he will. For me...I'll be listening to XRT & MVP....and enjoying the CSFMB

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Proud to be UNVERIFIED.

the cubs season was a failure because they were the best team in the national league and couldnt win ONE playoff game

the sox season was a success because they had the 3rd or 4th most talent in the division and exceeded expectations by winning the division.

also the cubs looked terrible in the playoffs
the sox looked like they got beat by the better team but had a fuckn heartbeat


ya know what im done. i know a lot of my cub fan bretheren are retardedly optimistic but looking at this season and playoff choke as anything other than an epic failure is too much.


GREAT JOB in 2008 cubs...go cubs go...SAMMYYYYYYY..."gracie goes to bars man"..."once wood and prior come back..." "augieeeeeeeee" "we got wood"

i guess growing up on the south side as a cub fan is a little different. look at things a little more realistic...a little less auggieeeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!

This is what started this. It was a moronic post. It should not have been replied to except perhaps by similar moronic Sox fans, moronic defined as agreeing with this post. This thread needs to die now. Please let it.

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Ба́бушка гада́ла, да на́двое сказа́ла—то ли до́ждик, то ли снег, то ли бу́дет, то ли нет.

No. What started this whole thing is when I said "The Cubs season was a failure, and the Sox season was not." Nobody has done anything to prove that statement wrong.

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No, no - I want the credit! Please look at me and give me credit!!!

I guess I finally agree with you - as a die-hard Sox fan, you had very low expectations for your team. They exceeded them - you win.

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Sharp as a marble you are.

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Frank, you predicted the Cubs and Sox would not make the playoffs. Both teams were starting with the same set of Frank expectations. Therefore according to your definition, both teams seasons were not failures, not just the Sox. Deeper than that, each and every fan has different expectations. It does not make any sense to make a blanket statement like that. There are Sox fans who view the season as a failure...there are Cubs fans who view the season as a non-failure.

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Ба́бушка гада́ла, да на́двое сказа́ла—то ли до́ждик, то ли снег, то ли бу́дет, то ли нет.

God you Cub fans are dense.


Happy 101st!

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"Polish a Turd" and "Sharp as a marble"?

How old are you? I never realized you were in your 70's. Nice lil quips you got there, gramps!

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Definition

The condition or fact of not achieving the desired end or ends: the failure of an experiment.




That they went into the year looking like a third-place team but ended up with 89 victories failed to impress GM Ken Williams.

"I'm a black-and-white kind of guy," he said. "Either you win it or you don't, so we get back to work."
Frank here your statement isWRONG

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I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

I'm out.

Your posts in the past have been entertaining, refreshing, intelligent and honest, to state a few characteristics. So seeing your name, I clicked on the topic. I did not realize it was in the Sox section. I will leave you to your private Soxual pleasures with your fellow Sox fans. I too rarely post in the Sox section due to my general disbelief in the Sox very existance.

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Ба́бушка гада́ла, да на́двое сказа́ла—то ли до́ждик, то ли снег, то ли бу́дет, то ли нет.

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You give Sox fans a bad name

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I'm going to bounce from the spot for awhile but I will be back at some point to argue with you about this hoops stuff again. Playoffs have been great this season. See ya up the road.

I'm out.

Ding.

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This is my signature...

Frank, both teams exceeded your win totals. You predicted that both teams wouldn't make the playoffs.
If something exceeds your expectation levels, isn't considered somewhat of a success?
In this case, the Cubs fans are correct.
As for Spank, he still doesn't get it. The Cubs entered this season as reigning NL Central champs and made "perceived" quality improvements to their roster: Fukudome, moving Wood to closer and getting Dempster out of the closer's role, leaving Soto behind the plate and Theriot in the infield.
Getting Johnson's input, adding Edmonds and Harden only increased the perceived belief that the Cubs would make the World Series. Getting swept in the first round of the playoffs, can make one believe this season was a failure.
White Sox go 72-90 a year ago, then they add Swisher? Quentin? and Ramirez? Denks and Floyd are pegged to play a more active role in the rotation. Swisher falters but the other four flourish -- saw that coming????
Then CQ is lost for the rest of the season. They still should have no problems making the playoffs?????
After the sweep in Minnesota and two losses to Cleveland, I still had plenty of confidence in my team????????
Making the playoffs was unexpected -- given these circumstances. Making the World Series was more of a dream, since they were obviously the fourth-best team in the ALDS. I was disappointed when they lost games 1, 2 and 4, but I wasn't distraught. I have hope for the future.
I don't know if Cubs fans can feel the same way. It appeared that they had solved their postseason problems, and then more were created this time around.

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President of Blake Shetlon fan club

I am a moron.

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Ба́бушка гада́ла, да на́двое сказа́ла—то ли до́ждик, то ли снег, то ли бу́дет, то ли нет.

You forgot the asterisk.

**Only a "ding" if the current season's success is based on previous season's performance. Only Frank was arguing that - with himself. That makes no sense to me.
Let's try and parallel this: If the NY Giants go to the SB again this year, but lose, Frank says their season is a failure. But if the Vikings make the playoffs, lose in the divisional round, their season is a success. According to Frank.....

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ah ha...

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This is my signature...

Replace Vikings with Bears, since the Vikings were predicted to be good this year, and the Bears were not, and it's a true statement.

If we are making comparisons, the Vikings are the Tigers of the NFC North.
The Bears are like the White Sox of the NFC North.

Are you saying that the Bears won't have had a successful season if they only make the playoffs? Most Bears fans, just like most Sox fans, would have taken that in a heartbeat before the season started.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Agreed.

No I get that - I myself had high expectations. This Cubs season was, overall, a failure. No doubt. Although, looking back, remember that many questioned the moves of Dempster/Wood.

This supports my argument, not Frank's. The expectations of BOTH teams changed as soon as the season started. Quentin was the real deal right away, until getting hurt. Danks and Floyd produced greatly. AND - Detroit and Cleveland struggled immensely. At that point, the Sox expectations changed immensely, didn't they?


These are similar to the bumps along the way that every contending team faces - including the Cubs. No different for the Sox.

Again - both team's "holes" were exposed late in the year. Both have work to do if they want to improve. Both had the same result this year. I feel more confident in the future of the Cub's core hitters than the Sox right now:(Ramirez, Soto, Soriano, Lee, DeRosa, Theriot) vs. (Konerko, Thome, Dye, Ramirez, Quentin, Pyrzienski) - not a whole lot better, but some of the Sox is quite a bit older than the Cubs.

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Not quite. If at the start of December, the Bears are 8-4 and in first place from now until then, and maintain 1st until the start of the playoffs, aren't our expectations for them going to increase at that point? A first round bounce at the hands of, say, the Redskins (parallel to the Rays? Best I could come up with) will not qualify as a success in my book. The expectations change once the season starts and you see where you actually are relative to all the other teams. Preseason predictions don't matter anymore.

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Our expectations may increase, but the season is judged as a whole. By your criteria, only one team can ever consider the season to be a success. If they were in first place at 8-4, then expectations change and you expect a first round win. Then you win the first game, and you expect a second round win. Where does it stop? Every team that has ever played and lost in the Super Bowl would have had an unsuccessful season, because as soon as you make it to the Super Bowl, your expectations change.

By the same logic, the 2007 Bears would also be reevaluated as they clearly weren't a good team. I would call 2007 a failure for the Bears, but that's based off of preseason predictions and where they ended the previous year. Winning a championship is the ultimate goal, but I don't see how you can have a criteria where all but one team fails to have a successful season.

Do you disagree that if the Bears make the playoffs this year, that it will have been a successful season even if they lose in the first round? I'm not sure if you made a prediction in the Bears prediction thread, but even my optimistic view had them at 8-8 and I was in the minority of people with a positive outlook. With that said, winning the NFC North or even being a wildcard team would be a success to me.

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You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Nope. If the Bears make the postseason, then Bears fans can correctly label this season as being a success. If the Vikings fail to make the playoffs, then it is a failure.

The White Sox simply had the better season, all things considered. More was learned about the future of that team and how promising things are now looking for the future, whereas the Cubs have now made the postseason two years in a row AND got swept out immediately. The Cubs have no idea what is wrong, while the Sox have a better idea of what is right.

Thome 38
Dye 34
Konerko 32
Pierzynski 31
Ramirez 27
Quentin 26

Lee 33
DeRosa 33
Soriano 32
Ramirez 30
Theriot 28
Soto 25

Doesn't really seem like much of a difference other than Thome. Also, even though he sucked this year, Swisher will probably be around for another year or 2 and he's only 27. Good news for Sox fans...the 2 best players on that list are also the 2 youngest players.

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Yes you could - a place setting designed for toddlers.

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OH NO YOU DIDUNT