With the addition of our lead-off guy who can't field, Alex Rios, Peavy, Quentin's unreliability and the emergence of Beckham, Nix and Getz, I'm curious what next year will look like?

Any ideas?

Is it a forgone conclusion that Thome and Dye will not return? Thome will take less money, you know?

This, I know, for sure: Peavy, Buerhle, Floyds, Dank and AJ.

Probabilities but not 100% sure: PK at 1B, Getz at 2B, Ramirez at SS, Bacon at 3B, Rios in CF and CQ in LF/RF??

50/50: Thome=gone, Dye=gone, Pods=gone, Jenk=gone.

Definitely, please: Contreras, Linebrink, Colon and Dotel?

Just curious what the ever-so-knowledgeable White Sox fans on this board think?

keep dye get rid of thome and make pods the DH

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team Mully & Hanley
team Meatpants

agree but unforuntally need thome for the left handed stick if he comes cheap....

figgins is kenny's love child but will need uncle jerry to open the purse strings some more and this point why not.....

you should be able to get something for tubby i mean jenkes as long as he dosent get any fatter or keep blowing saves.....

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“Be Who You Are and Say What You Feel Because Those Who Mind Don't Matter and Those Who Matter Don't Mind.” ~ Dr. Suess


Nice Guys Finish Last

Thank you,and have a nice day !

I know Jenks has been struggling, but who's the closer for next year?

Does Figgin play CF or 3B? If Sox do get Figgins and he's put at 3B, the "Domino Effect" occurs.

figgins to 3rd, bacon to ss, alexi to cf or trade him with jenkes. thoratan closes

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“Be Who You Are and Say What You Feel Because Those Who Mind Don't Matter and Those Who Matter Don't Mind.” ~ Dr. Suess


Nice Guys Finish Last

Thank you,and have a nice day !

Figgins to 3rd, bacon to SS, Alexei to 2nd, Rios in CF, Thornton closer

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

I think Thome will do the Frank Thomas tour of MLB with a couple one-year, incentive laden contracts. I don't see why the Sox would re-sign him when they're in "transition." Dye could stick around and do just as well as Thome in the DH role, with the added ability of hitting LHP. I don't buy the "lefty stick" in the lineup idea. I guess it looks nice ("it looks like baseball, dammit!"), but it doesn't really do much for me empirically, especially when you're going to end up platooning the hitter with a different guy against southpaws.

It helps that Dye has said he, too, would take a deep discount to stick with the team. I like the team's chances with him in the lineup for the next couple years over Thome.

Ideal, given what we have:

1B - Konerko
2B - Beckham
3B - Viciedo / F.A. signing (Hank Blalock, a player I've wanted the Sox to go after for years, is on a club option for 2009 and becomes available this off-season.)
SS - Alexei Ramirez
LF - Quentin
CF - Rios
RF - Mitchell / Dye
C - Pierzynski / Flowers
DH - Dye

If Kenny's serious about bringing in the new look of the team, he'll give Mitchell, Flowers, and Viciedo a real chance to make the big club out of spring training. Based on what they've accomplished thus far, they deserve the shot.

Pitching is somewhat up for grabs with the Peavy trade and possible signing / release. If I were in Kenny's shoes, my priority would be to clear the deck of all the pitchers that have been in the system for years and haven't shown much in the way of development. Whisler, Torres, Egbert, etc., these guys all need to move on. If Daniel Hudson's "the real," it would be nice to see him get a chance to start rather than join the bullpen.

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Here's what I think your 2010 White Sox will look like, and this doesn't include what trades or free agent signings they'll explore in the offseason:
Outfielders:
51 Alex Rios CF
LF & RF will be open competitions as Scott Podsednik will be released, Carlos Quentin & Jermaine Dye will be subjects of trade talks.
Infielders:
15 Gordon Beckham 3B
10 Alexei Ramirez SS
17 Chris Getz 2B (Will Play More vs. Lefties!)
14 Paul Konerko 1B
Backup Infielders:
Chone Figgins (Currently w/Anaheim)
30 Mark Kotsay 1B
Catchers:
12 A.J. Pierzynski (May Be Trade Target)
27 Ramon Castro
Tyler Flowers will be invited to Spring Training, but will not make the Opening Day Roster
Closer
37 Matt Thornton
Bobby Jenks will be dealt...

No way they sign Figgins and make him a backup.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

fixed

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team Mully & Hanley
team Meatpants

Sucker's,

Appreciate your insightful thoughts. From what I've heard about this Hudson: 5th starter (with a solid 2010 Spring Training)=Hudson.

Question: who is Mitchell? And why can't the young Cuban kid be DH? Doesn't Getz deserve a chance?

Who can we get for Jenk? Pods and Quentin traded for outfielders??

RFDC, I think you're probably right, but all indications are that Beckham may be the full time third baseman on the South side long term. If the White Sox sign Chone, you move Alexei to CF, shift Rios to RF and move Gordon to second. Getz then becomes a trade target, but I think the economy will dictate what kinds of moves the Sox make in 2010. Uncle Jerry is worried sick about possibly losing even more sponsors for '10 and even more $$$$ out of his pocket...

I'd really love for Hudson to just get a chance at the 5th spot in the rotation, like you say. Handcuff him with a long arm out of the bullpen (like Carrasco's done this year) and keep him on an innings limit if you must, but give the guy a shot. I'm not really happy with the way many organizations have chosen to treat their pitching prospects, by slotting them into relief roles. For example, the Yankees still don't quite seem to know what to do with Joba Chamberlain. If a guy's not ready to start in the majors, let him continue to start in the minors. John Danks had 400+ innings pitched in the minor leagues and I think he was better off for it. By all accounts, Hudson seems like he's on the Lincecum / Felix Hernandez track, and neither the Giants nor the Mariners screwed around with those guys, they just let them pitch.

Mitchell is Jared Mitchell, the Sox' 1st round draft pick this year. They got him signed with relative ease and ever since he's been on the warpath in the South Atlantic League, posting a slash line of .287/.415/.448 in 87 at-bats. It's likely that he'll end up in AA Birmingham next season but I don't think he's long for the minors. The approach he's shown thus far is far more polished and mature than many would have had you think on draft day - he was labeled a "raw athlete," which in baseball tends to mean a defense-first hacker who lucks into good contact.

You're probably right that by ignoring Getz I'm being a little too hard on him, but I don't see how he figures into the team's long term plans. He's a little old for his debut and is nothing better than a bottom of the order hitter with mediocre range at any given spot in the infield. I'd take my chances on Nix or a possible F.A. signing / trade before I'd run Getz out there again full time. I think Getz, more than anyone else on the team, is why you're hearing (and reading, here) so much clamor for Chone Figgins.

I want Viciedo to be given a chance to make the team next year, but again, that has more to do with my hope that KW will live up to his word re: "transition." Viciedo hasn't been all that impressive at AA this season (he's got the worst stats of the three I mentioned), but by all accounts he's been hitting the ball really hard. What I don't like is the idea of using the DH spot on a rookie or younger player - the DH role is better served by allowing older guys who can still hit the ball a long way to get time off the field and avoid injury. Thome wouldn't be a good look in the NL at 1B but he's been great as a DH. The uglier Dye looks in the field, the better off I think he'll be in the DH slot the next couple of years.

Addendum: The issue with "transition" is that the makeup of the team has changed quite a bit over the past couple of weeks. The addition of Peavy and Rios says to me that some of these younger players we're already familiar with (Getz, Lillibridge, Nix, and even prospects like Viciedo and Jordan Danks) are going to eventually be pushed out by further bulking-up of the roster with FA / trades. Peavy doesn't come here if he's led to believe that the team's going to go into a "re-building" period, and Kenny will likely operate the way he always has, by finding value in re-treads and other organizations' missed opportunities. The problem for him might be that certain guys, Getz especially, have failed to show much worth and are no longer as attractive to other GMs as they might have been going into the season.

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If you're flipping infielders around, Beckham to short and Alexei back to 2nd. To say he has been dissapointing at SS this year is a gross understatement.

The only knock on Getz is that he can only play 2nd base, but otherwise he's been pretty solid this season.

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For next season, I expect Beckham to stay at 3B, Ramirez at SS and Getz at 2B.

I'd lean toward Dye probably returning, but don't rule out the Sox keeping Thome because he provides power from the left side. Dye has indicated that he would take a pay cut to return so it may come down to who would stay for cheaper. There's also the possibilty that neither return, the Sox resign Podsednik for 1 year in LF, keep Rios in CF and move Quentin to RF. Of course, even under than scenario, one of these guys could resign for DH.....or the Sox can rotate Konerko/Quentin/Podsednik at DH, and even AJ if Flowers is ready for the majors next season.

In short, Kenny Williams has a lot to decide upon, but I do look for Getz to return at 2B because he has shown enough this season to warrant the job, and he makes no money.

Linebrink will probably be back unless the Sox are able to convince some team to take the remaining 2 years at $4 million apeice. I find that unlikely unless we take back someone's garbage in return.

Dotel is gone. He's a good relief pitcher, but I think the Sox will look to fill this spot with a rookie.

Chris Getz, .prior to hitting the DL: 267/.325/.367. That's not "solid," nor is it enough to warrant giving the guy a full time job again. It doesn't help that (by the numbers) his glove / lack of range are a liability. The more I learn about Chris Getz, the less I like him.

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I think he has played better as the season has progressed, and, for a rookie, I do think it's solid. Of course, we need to get better at that position, but I think he has shown enough to have the job next season.

Before he went on the disabled list with the lower oblique injury, Chris Getz had been playing as well as any player on the White Sox roster. While his overall batting average at .267 isn't anything special, consider this. He was batting .333 in the last 33 games before going on the DL, and in the 2 games I watched #17 first hand, he really impressed me with his ability to hit in the clutch and HIT LEFTIES. Needless to say, Getz can't come back soon enough with Jayson Nix scuffling in recent weeks playing both at second base and at shortstop when Alexei Ramirez was out with the sprained ankle. Getz should be the full time second baseman next spring. At the conclusion of last night's 8-7 win over the Royals, Brent Lillibridge actually relieved Nix at second base in the top 9th. If there's any Sox player I could live without in '10, it's Brent with that long swing and his unwillingness to cut down on his stroke.

Chris Getz is the kind of guy that, every year, you will say to yourself, "we need to get better at that position". Then you will look at the cost of a replacement and the percentage increase in production and say "we can live with him another year".

I think Getz is a lock because of his contract and average production.

I cannot help but think KW will make a push for Figgens. I really do wonder what type of market will develop for a 32 year old speed player with some inconsistent stats over the last 3 years. He emodies the new James theory on veteran free agents to be wary of signing. I cannot believe he will get over 8 million and 3 years and I think that would be generous.

RF Quentin,
CF Rios,
LF Pods with Jordan Danks getting an opportunity to battle him is spring training

DH Dye (under an $8 million one year contract with an option)

1B Konerko
2b Getz
SS Ramirez
3B Beckham

C FLOWERS

Starters
Buehrle
Peavy
Danks
Floyd

It will absolutely be the right time to trade AJ. He is above his average in all hitting categories which covers his defensive liabilities. He also hates to be challenged for playing time by a quality backup. Maybe he can be packaged with someone and sent to Tampa for Crawford, who will be in the last year of his contract and it has been reported will be definitely moved. Hey, I'll shoot for the moon and say he and Getz for Crawford and then sign Figgens to play 3rd. Imagine this lineup:

3B Figgens
LF Crawford
2B Beckham
DH Dye
RF Quentin
1B Konerko
CF Rios
C Flowers
SS Ramirez

The only problem with that group is the lack of lefthanded hitting.

Thinking about that more Getz and AJ make about 7 million combined. Crawford make 8.25 and I think Figgens will make 8, so that is an increase of 9.25 million. Peavy adds another 15 and Rios another 10 for a total of about 35 million.

Under my scenario you lose Thome at 13, Contrearas at 10, Dotel at 4 and decrease Dye by another 4 for a total of 31. If you can have that lineup for 4 million more per year, KW will be legendary.

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O judgment! Thou art fled to brutish beasts,
And men have lost their reason.

Getz had been getting progressively better on the field and at the plate post All Star break. I stand by my "solid" description.

Besides, you can live with a Chris Getz hitting 8th or 9th, and worry about fixing other areas of the team.

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Crawford's a left-handed bat, but he has the same problem I described above, he can't hit his own kind. I understand you need to give pitchers a different look throughout the order but I don't see the merit in adding a lefty bat just to do it. That said, I do think Crawford would be a great "get." It just gets kind of scary, to me, in that you'll have some young players on the wrong end of a platoon with more established players taking up the bulk of playing time.

Still don't like Getz - if his glove didn't cost the team as many runs as his hitting, I might change my mind, but I haven't seen anything out of him other than a competent base stealer with a high success rate. At least he's been hitting at the bottom of the order.

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Frank, I think Chris is an ideal #2 hitter, not necessarily giving you home run power, but a better chance to get on base, advance the runner, and steal a base. If Chris can take some more walks, steal a base and be even more patient at the plate, #17 could someday become the team's leadoff hitter one day. Seriously.

His OBP is pretty terrible, though. I don't care what he "might" do; at his size and his age, more than likely he "is what he is." Power hitters develop late; slappy on-base guys develop early.

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This actually makes a lot of sense to me, I would be satisfied with that roster.
kudos for breaking down some of the $$ figures. Well done.

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1926-1931-1934-1942-1944-1946-1964-1967-1982-2006-2011

Here's a name we haven't heard since Spring Training, White Sox fans, Dayan Viciedo. It felt very curious that he inherited Joe Crede's #24 when the Sox reported for Spring Training in Glendale, AZ, but other than that, it appears as if Viciedo will have to learn a new position if he finds his way to U.S. Cellular Field as soon as 2010. It appears as if Gordon Beckham may be locked in at third base, based on what I've heard, along with Alexei Ramirez at shortstop and Getz becoming the everyday second baseman. I think Viciedo may have to learn first base where Paul Konerko is right now or he may have to learn a corner outfield spot. I'm not sure he's Major League ready, let alone if he'll be among the September call-ups.

Suckers: I have to say I agree with literally every single word of your post.

I say put Beckham at 2B and keep him there for the next 15 years. I was also hoping they could get Rolen at the deadline to solidify the D and allow Beckham to move to 2B. That was probably asking a lot with him signed at $12 million this year and next, but at the same time, they have a lot of salary coming off the books.

I agree, this will be the lineup we will see next year and agree 100% on the pitching, continue to flush the system.

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No thanks to Rolen. He is done.

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

"We're not here to talk nonsense to Bob Loblaw."

Maybe not Rolen in particular, but someone like him would be a signature low-risk / high reward move by KW. "My guy" for a rehab project is Blalock, but any 3B of that type would be worth taking a look at.

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Sorry All im thinking about is Arrested Devolopment now...Bob Loblaw was good but Barry Zuckerkorn was special



Barry Zuckerkorn: So basically you're about 2,000 shares short of being the majority stock holders. Now unfortunately it's a private stock so you can not just buy up the shares unless someone is willing to sell
Michael: Are you sure?
Barry Zuckerkorn: That's what it said on 'Ask Jeeves'


Michael: Yes, this is Michael Bluth for Barry.
Barry Zuckerkorn: [to his secretary] I'm not here.
Barry's Secretary: Barry's not in right now. Would you like to leave her a message?
Michael: Yeah, tell her she needs to whisper a little softer next time, AND I'm not paying for this phone call.
Barry Zuckerkorn: I am not a girl, you...
Barry's Secretary: [pulls out a tape recorder] Go ahead, call me something. I'm redecorating my kitchen.

Narrator: On the next Arrested Development, Barry receives a sign from God.
Barry Zuckerkorn: [Seeing a replica of the Ten Commandments on top of his car] I will obey your will, I will lead a good life.
[Sees a parking ticket on his car]
Barry Zuckerkorn: Well, to hell with this then.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Barry Zuckerkorn: It would help if you all showed up, looking like a loving, supportive family.
Lucille: For how long?
Barry Zuckerkorn: Ten minutes tops.
Lucille: See if you can get it down to five.

Lindsay Funke: Barry, did you talk to a doctor?
Barry Zuckerkorn: I did. I have poison oak. Do you believe it? How the hell did I get that?
[Cut to a shot of a rest area]
Lucille Bluth: She was talking about George.
Barry Zuckerkorn: Oh, he's the same. Look, I guess we should decide on who's going to speak for the family. I would, but I have Laker tickets.
[Cut to a shot of the rest area]


Barry: And you don’t want to go in front of that judge. I caught him in a drag club. G.O.B.: What were you doing there? Barry: Wow…you should be the lawyer.

Barry: Well, if you want to play Eve, you got to get in line behind what, above five homos. That was wrong. I-I am so sorry. It’s just that I have one down at the office now, and I mean it is every day