Celtics by 21 with 10 minutes to go.

shouldn't you be watching the hawks?

_________________
team Mully & Hanley
team Meatpants

Intermission.

_________________
team Mully & Hanley
team Meatpants

Mike Brown might want to start working on that resume. This was a huge choke. You can't lose this game, if you're a number 1 seed.

_________________
Fuck Edwards and Zobrist

The fact they lost by 32 at home is awful.

_________________

Unless he has a big game and saves the day in game 6 this will hurt his legacy greatly.

If you are the best player on the planet you can't totally disappear like that in the most important game in franchise history up to this point.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Are those who think Jordan was better still idiots (at least according to Boers and Bernstein)?

Let's see how Lebron bounces back in game 6. It's not like Jordan never had a bad game. He just always came back and made up for it.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

While LeBron could end up better than Jordan they are complete idiots to believe he is better now.

_________________

Fair - I don't discount, and it may even be likely, that James dominates the remainder of this series, and Cleveland wins in 7.

Even if they believe that James is better than Jordan right now, it's pretty ridiculous of them to say you're an idiot if you don't agree with them on this.

If it was the last home game, LeBron really stunk, shoulder or no shoulder. This was supposed to be the Cavaliers' best chance to win a championship for a city that has nothing to show for it since the old Browns in 1964. Chances are, if the Cavs lose in Game 6 tomorrow in Boston, it may not only enhance LeBron leaving as a free agent this summer, but I've also got to wonder about head coach Mike Brown. He was outcoached last year in the Eastern Conference Finals by the Ron Jeremy-looking Stan Van Gundy and the Magic, and appears to be getting outcoached again by Glenn "Doc" Rivers and a Celtics' team that kinda struggled and appeared to be showing their age down the stretch. If Brown's Cavs are eliminated tomorrow, he should never be allowed to coach in the NBA again! He makes Vinny Del Negro look like a genius in comparison!

I think that series will be a defining moment of Lebron's career unless he goes on a Jordan-like stretch where he was clearly the best player for 8 years(including his hiatus). It wasn't just that the team lost but it was how bad he looked even if he put up decent looking numbers. I'm more knowledgeable now than I was when Jordan was working towards winning his first title but I don't think that ever happened to Jordan.

Lebron is a more complete player than Jordan but he's got a lot of work to do to be a better player in the future. If anything, Lebron is just as good as Jordan was but Jordan went to another level that no one else ever had around this time in his career. This is the same level that Kobe topped out at.

One of the things that I was thinking of while watching his final game in a Cleveland uniform was that his total skill set may actually be a detriment to him. He relied on his teammates all season because he is really good at distributing the ball. In crunch time, the other Cavs would sometimes go whole possessions without Lebron touching the ball in a meaningful way. You can't have the greatest player in the world just standing there.

Lebron had a big chance to prove how great of a player he is. He didn't and if anything he did the opposite and showed that having a better all around game doesn't mean you are a better player. I'm not ready to give up on Lebron but there is no way that I'd say that Lebron is better than Jordan was at the same age. I knew they may lose to a good team in the Celtics but the best player in NBA history doesn't go down like that.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

I agree with you on every point except LBJ being better and more complete than MJ. I just dont think he is as good as MJ was at his peak right now. Maybe he gets better. Two years in a row of losing as the favorite isnt a good trend to be starting though.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Never coach again? VDN a genius by comparison?

Yes - the expectations were much greater, but the guy is 272-138 in the regular season and 42-29 in the post-season. There have been coaches who had nowhere near the track record who were "allowed" to coach again.

I don't think he's as good as MJ was at his peak. I think he's as good as Jordan at the same age.

I do think he is a more complete player. I don't think Jordan was the unstoppable force of both rebounding and assists. However, that may actually hurt him in the long run as deferring to others too much. He may need to shape his game to make himself more of an offensive weapon while lowering his assists/rebounds totals.

_________________
You do not talk to me like that! I work too hard to deal with this stuff! I work too hard! I'm an important member of the CSFMB! I drive a Dodge Stratus!

Well said. I'm on record as saying I believe no one in history has had more talent than LeBron. LeBron issues are mental. I'm not so sure that hasn't always been the problem but we usually give him a pass for it. Now I'm not sure if he will be better than Kobe let alone MJ.

_________________

Well it's too difficult to compare MJ and LeBron. While I dont think LeBron was as good as MJ at age 25, he definitely wasnt even close to MJ at the end of their seventh seasons as pros. Either way I think the comparison is ridiculous and only being perpetuated because the media collectively, and prematurely, decided Kobe was done and they didnt have anyone left to compare LeBron to.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

With the rules of the game he could average 40 if he wanted to. He doesn't have the mental toughness. That separates the great from the all time great. IMO Derrick Coleman had far more talent than Malone or Barkley but he was a complete nutcase. Add Richard Dumas to that list. Talent only gets you so far.

_________________

Right, which is why I assume when someone says Player A is better than Player B it means that the player is actually a better finished product right now, not just having more potential talent.

If someone wanted to say LeBron is more talented than MJ, it is debateable. I dont think it's debateable who was the better player after their 7th seasons in the NBA though.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Richard Dumas is a major blast from the past....wow

Hadn't thought about him in ages

You're right, he had a lot of talent and potential