So those you reproduce others music are the low end right? Wow so how we supposed to hear Mozart and Bach as thier music was written before recording devices? WOw you have no clue.

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When I am stuck and need to figure something out I always remember the Immortal words of Socrates when he said:"I just drank what?"

Let me change this to another form of art. Let's say I copy a famous painting exactly, would you call me a talented artist if this was all I was able to do well?

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"Play until it hurts, then play until it hurts to not play."
http://soundcloud.com/darkside124 HOF 2013, MM Champion 2014

In the time I grew up, with my experiences, the concept that one had to be an accomplished musician to play rock and roll was anathema. Rock and roll is about ideas and feelings. Great rock and roll can give other ideas and make others feel. It has nothing to do with reading sheet music or understanding tablature. I played in some good bands, one I'd call nearly great. Not many people heard us but that wasn't what we were after. Trying to make money? We'd have called that "careerist" or "mersh". It seemed to me as the musicians got better the bands often got worse. Instead of the players serving the songs, the songs became slaves to the players. I'd break it down like this. If you think Joe Satriani was a better guitarist than Johnny Thunders, I probably don't want to discuss music with you. I believe it was Yeats who said, "The best lack all conviction while the worst are filled with a passionate intensity."

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Don't take it personally.

The people arguing me are right. 101 Proof is equally as talented as Pantera, AC/DShe is just as good as AC/DC, and Lez Zeppelin can stand tall with Led Zeppelin. I'll see myself out.

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then, my friend...we shall never discuss music together.

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@audioidkid

douchebag, you're confusing talent with creativity. it still takes skill and talent to be able to play an instrument and read music. i can do neither. but i'm creative.

a guy i know is a very very skilled guitarist. he cannot "hear" music, though. we've played together and i had to tell him what key i was playing all the time...he couldn't follow otherwise. i'm the complete opposite. so obviously we work out great.

he can play bach. He can play the Hyrule Palace theme from Zelda.

but he doesn't write his own music and is in a cover band.

I put a grand total of one of my songs down on disc...it was just a chord progression with a second guitar doing a lead...if you want to call it that...I accidentally left it in my dad's convertable one night and my parents came home and asked what band it was...

...I figured I would just stop on that high note...

<Murph>Lettherecordshow</Murph>

I posted the Chilean U2 tribute band Lemon's video only to prove that not ALL tribute bands suck.
I wasn't even directing it at Douchebag.
How this became a referendum on what makes a true musician, I have no idea.
I'm still confused.


Whatever.

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Just chillin' like Garret Quillin.

if you are strive to be a "true musician" then you know what one is.

I understand what DB is saying. being able to play only Pantera songs perfectly, does not make you a musician...
however, i'd be quite impressed since I can't play Pantera songs perfectly...

still. if that is your only desire...then, maybe you are not developing the "artiste."

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@audioidkid

I am too.

Let's all come to an agreement.

Tributesaurous = BAD
Bands who write and perform their own material = GOOD

I think that's a good way to end this discussion.

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If you are a "true musician" is rock and roll the proper idiom for you?

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Don't take it personally.

If it doesn't make you a musician, what does it make you?
Should there be an official CSFMB definition of what makes a "Musician"?

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Just chillin' like Garret Quillin.

If a tree falls in the forest, does it ever get bitten and kicked?

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-"God is great. Beer is good. And People are crazy!"

alright. I've come around a bit.
you're right...if one can play Pantera songs flawlessly, then there is a REALLY good chance that one has other stuff that is quite good...
he's just a sellout then.

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@audioidkid

I feel I am having my words twisted in this thread. I said earlier that just because you can play someone elses songs perfectly, it doesn't necessarily mean you are a talented musician. I never said they weren't musicians. I'm not arguing the fact that someone cannot have talent on the guitar and play in a cover band, i'm just arguing that a person that goes out and writes and performs their own material has more talent in my opinion.

Please answer this question for me:
Who has more talent?
Dimebag Darrell or guy who makes a living pretending to be Dimebag Darrell?

I think the answer is pretty obvious.

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Well then, since it's quite clear that Mariah Carey is clearly a superior vocalist to M-ick Jagger by any objective measure, do you think the Stones would be better if Mariah replaced M-ick?

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Don't take it personally.

Tell that to Yo-Yo Ma.

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Just chillin' like Garret Quillin.

The answer is obvious.
The guy who is making a living.

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Just chillin' like Garret Quillin.

I think a true musician is one that is passionate about his craft and gives it 100% all the time. Its also means something to him and he's not just playing 'Livin on a Prayer' because the payday is good at the end of the night. He might be a terrible guitarist and compose horrendous lyrics, but he could still be a true musician in my mind's eye.

Chas brings up an excellent point regarding Bach and Beethoven etc.

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When you guys bump this I picture Spiegel in a lime green bathing suit.

I agree. I like Frank's opinions on music far better than his opinions on baseball. Nothing pisses me off more than paying money to see a half ass performance. The old blues guys were guilty of that a lot. I got into it with Junior Wells at Rosa's. He didn't like it when I accused him of cheating me. Go hit on white bitches on your own time. I paid to see your sorry old ass play that harp. How about a little effort. Fuck Buddy Guy's old ass too. Shuckin' and jivin' like Amos and Andy for a bunch of white folks from Palatine. Sheeeit! A real good friend of mine who is one hell of a guitar player had a gig at the old Legends opening up for Buddy. Buddy's soundmen wouldn't let him use the entire PA. That shit was just for Mr. Guy. When we asked them why they wouldn't want the paying customers to get the best sound possible, they had no fuckin' answer. I laugh every time I hear Clapton call that douchebag the best guitarist ever. He was scurred of a white boy from Villa Park sounding better than his geriatric self. Sheeeit! Then there was the time at Biddy Mulligan's when Bo Diddley threatened to kick my ass. He might have been able to do it too. But he was playing like a pussy so he deserved to be called out.

I want to temper this ranting with a good story though. One of my friends was trying to bang this broad and she mentioned she was going to see some guy I never heard of at Double Door. His name was R.L. Burnside. He begged me to come with him. When he said it was blues, I refused. I had seen enough of that shit. But he whined until I relented. That was one of the great rock and roll shows I have ever seen. Those guys played harder than Slayer. I got high with Kenny and Cedric after they rocked the fuck out of that place. Well, well, well.

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Don't take it personally.

If you can play music, you are a musician.

If you can play music and you are really good, whether or not you write your own music... you are a talented musician.

If you write your own music, you are a musician and a songwriter.

If you write your own music and are really good, you are both a talented musician and talented songwriter.

I play a mean triangle. Write my own stuff for it too.

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Well put. Thank you Chris.

I feel like this thread just received an enema.

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-"God is great. Beer is good. And People are crazy!"

chris is good at enemas

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"He is a loathsome, offensive brute
--yet I can't look away."

You're welcome.

Looks like Meatpants had a great time, although I think its arguable whether his girlfriend looks great in a bikini:

The guy who pretending to be Darrell because he is alive.

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When I am stuck and need to figure something out I always remember the Immortal words of Socrates when he said:"I just drank what?"

Steppin on mah comedy bitz, chas.


"The answer is obvious.
The guy who is making a living. "

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Just chillin' like Garret Quillin.