How can you say a guy is finished when all he does is go out and win games 3 out of 4 days. Shouldn't he at least have a losing record before he can be finished.

2016 Wade Miley: 6-3 over 13 starts, 5.28 ERA (75 ERA+), 4.84 FIP and 1.383 WHIP; He is 5-1 when he gives up 4+ runs

vs.

2016 Jose Quintana: 5-7 across 14 starts, 2.63 ERA (152 ERA+), 2.60 FIP (league-leading) and 1.083 WHIP; He is 5-5 when he gives up 3 or fewer runs

Who ya got?

For reference, AL starters give up 3 or fewer runs, on average, 61% of the time, Jose Quintana has done it 86% of the time this season.

Sure. Maybe the Cubs will pick him up.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Are you really going to throw a 13 game sample out there? Really?

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

I can't agree with your first statement when it comes to Quintana because your last statement has been true in 90% of his starts. If he were like Vasquez and was a HoFer for 5 innings and then gave up 6 runs after that I would agree with the first statement. He's only given up more than 4 runs in 14 of his nearly 136 starts and 2 or less in 85. That should be good enough to win.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

I think this is the thread you all finally change JORR's mind.

_________________
Fare you well, fare you well
I love you more than words can tell
Listen to the river sing sweet songs
To rock my soul

Well, yeah. You're the one who boils down a pitcher's performance to how he performs in "the game in front of him" as opposed to in the aggregate, so why is sample size an issue all of a sudden? Because you just realized that your idiocy on this topic must result in you taking Wade goddamn Miley over Jose Quintana?

This is where you're full of shit. I've been posting his career numbers for weeks. In 85 of his 136 starts he's given up 2 runs or less. In ONLY 14 starts has he given up more than 4 runs.


http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/917 ... son=2016_2

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

You can't change his mind because he's dug his heels in and he's full of shit.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

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Over a career that's true though.

If a guy loses more than he wins, for whatever reason, he is a loser.

The second part can be used to give context and a deeper understanding of his individual performance.

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In over 60% of his starts Quintana is that guy. Besides it's a hypothetical question and based on your posting history we all know that you would take the 10 run guy because "he wins". There is no need to dodge a question now.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

He's under .500 in about 140 career starts.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Yeah, if you can find him I'll take him, but again, he doesn't exist.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

He has a career 3 ERA too and it has improved every season but he continues to lose. In fact he had a better record the season his ERA was the highest than he does now that he has a sub 3 ERA. He's more games under .500 this season than he was coming into the season. He's 5-1 when he gives up 1 run and 0-6 when he gives up more than 1.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Good point. Looking back I'm now convinced Bill Bonham was as good as Pedro.

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Proud member of the white guy grievance committee

It aint the six minutes. Its what happens in those six minutes.

The Sox have scored 3 or fewer runs in 33 of this games, 2 runs or fewer in 21 and 1 run or fewer in 12 gamds. They're 25 and 8 when they score 4 or more runs.

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Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Neither were "internet" or "cell phone signal"

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

"Run support" is a steroid era creation for losing pitchers. In normal baseball there are lots of 3-2 and 2-1 games. Losing pitchers lose most of them.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Bad offenses lose most of them.

A good offense can score 2 more easily than a bad offense can score 2.

Why do you think the pitcher has 99% control of the game and offenses only have 1%?

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

Good offenses don't beat the best pitchers often. That's why those guys are the best pitchers.

_________________
Anybody here seen my old friend Bobby?
Can you tell me where he's gone?
I thought I saw him walkin' up to The Hill
With Elon, Tulsi, and Don

Unless you're the 2016 Chicago Cubs.

I wonder why Kershaw has no World Series.

I wonder why the Mets didn't win the World Series last year.

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Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

I'm watching the Cubs game. When I see OPS in the batting line, I have no real understanding of what's good/bad. Seems like I just got used to seeing OBP. I enjoy baseball the less I know about newer metrics and the less I read threads like this.

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Sex isn't dirty, sex isn't a crime. It's a loving act between two or more consenting adults.

-Hank Kingsley

Lower is better, like golf.

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We can teach you Furious.

.900+ is amazing.
.800+ is good.
.730 OPS or so is usually league average, excluding pitchers.

_________________
Rick Hahn is the best GM in baseball.

This isn't 1916. You can't consistently score 1 or 2 runs and then have a game where you explode for 10. Sure it will say that you average 4 runs a game but we know the truth.

From 5/19-6/17 (27 games) the Sox averaged 3.78 runs a game. Take away the 2 games they scored 18 runs in this week and it's at 3.36.

In the games Quintana has pitched this season the Sox are averaging 2.64 runs a game. We both know all those runs weren't scored while he was pitching either.

_________________
Be well

GO BEARS!!!

Quintana is not only a good pitcher, he's a very good pitcher. He's probably a top 15-20 pitcher in the MLB. This is in-spite of the 1-2 runs that occasionally gives up in a 7+ IP effort.

the guy should quit baseball and become a priest. dude is already a saint.

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Reality is your friend, not your enemy. -- Seacrest

He's that rare top 20 pitcher who you run out there and expect to lose the game .

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Proud member of the white guy grievance committee

It aint the six minutes. Its what happens in those six minutes.

If you expect Quintana to carry the offense as well, that's probably an unreasonable demand.