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PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2024 10:52 am 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Jayden Daniels
https://youtu.be/2b-K-1_od0Y?si=8h9MuIKIqQI_5z7l

Warner says he's got a good arm but missed reads and throws. Is a little concerned about his accuracy, like he is with Maye. Likes that he pushes the ball down the field and makes second level throws.



If it were a choice of Fields or Daniels, I'd have stuck with Fields.


I completely agree with you. I would jump off of the Poles bandwagon if he drafted that kid. He appears to be more likely to bust than the other guys being considered as a top 4 QB.

I believe you are both going to be wrong.


If it's between Daniels and Fields I'm going with option C.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2024 10:57 am 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Jayden Daniels
https://youtu.be/2b-K-1_od0Y?si=8h9MuIKIqQI_5z7l

Warner says he's got a good arm but missed reads and throws. Is a little concerned about his accuracy, like he is with Maye. Likes that he pushes the ball down the field and makes second level throws.



If it were a choice of Fields or Daniels, I'd have stuck with Fields.


I completely agree with you. I would jump off of the Poles bandwagon if he drafted that kid. He appears to be more likely to bust than the other guys being considered as a top 4 QB.

I believe you are both going to be wrong.


I just believe he has the same issues Fields does, but he lacks the dynamic playmaking ability. I don't think straight line speed works for a QB in the NFL, especially when you are under 200 lbs.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2024 11:21 am 
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Nas wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Jayden Daniels
https://youtu.be/2b-K-1_od0Y?si=8h9MuIKIqQI_5z7l

Warner says he's got a good arm but missed reads and throws. Is a little concerned about his accuracy, like he is with Maye. Likes that he pushes the ball down the field and makes second level throws.



If it were a choice of Fields or Daniels, I'd have stuck with Fields.


I completely agree with you. I would jump off of the Poles bandwagon if he drafted that kid. He appears to be more likely to bust than the other guys being considered as a top 4 QB.

I believe you are both going to be wrong.


I just believe he has the same issues Fields does, but he lacks the dynamic playmaking ability. I don't think straight line speed works for a QB in the NFL, especially when you are under 200 lbs.

I believe he is a much better passer than you consider him, we will see. I would not take him over your Guy but he is my 2nd option.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2024 9:17 pm 
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Warner likes Daniels over Maye at #2. He was more complimentary of Penix than Maye. Simms, Orvlosky, and Warner seem to be down on Maye.

https://youtu.be/aYtgZM5tquk?si=sFQjXBxWuYM4lRUK

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 6:37 am 
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If healthy, I think this is the floor for C-Will:

198 passing yards a game
61.5 completion percentage
18 passing touchdowns
87 rating
57 QBR
6 wins

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 6:53 am 
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Warner breaking down C-Will. Williams sounds like Justin Fields all over again; holds the ball way too long and will end up taking a lot of sacks at the next level where you're not playing against 19 year-olds with north-of-five forty times:


Image


Image

Image



Mario Bro ALL-CAPS gets it:

Image

Image


If USC's offense was so bad last season, why was Miller Moss able to go up against a top 20 team/defense and smoke them like a pack of Parliament Lights? Throwing 6 touchdowns in the supposedly broken Riley Kingsbury offense on the way to trouncing the favored (USC +6.5) Cardinal College of Louisville.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:06 am 
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Nas wrote:
If healthy, I think this is the floor for C-Will:

198 passing yards a game
61.5 completion percentage
18 passing touchdowns
87 rating
57 QBR
6 wins


These are all a notch above the career highs of Fields.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:19 am 
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Hussra wrote:
Warner breaking down C-Will. Williams sounds like Justin Fields all over again; holds the ball way too long and will end up taking a lot of sacks at the next level where you're not playing against 19 year-olds with north-of-five forty times:


Yeah, I made this point a couple months ago. The flaws that we all saw in Fields are also frequently cited in scouting reports on Williams--and that's a HUGE concern. From the little I've seen of Williams, it looks like he has a quicker release, is more accurate, reads defenses better than Fields and makes anticipatory throws more frequently, but I need to do a lot more research before I feel comfortable with him as a solid QB prospect.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:22 am 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Hussra wrote:
Warner breaking down C-Will. Williams sounds like Justin Fields all over again; holds the ball way too long and will end up taking a lot of sacks at the next level where you're not playing against 19 year-olds with north-of-five forty times:


Yeah, I made this point a couple months ago. The flaws that we all saw in Fields are also frequently cited in scouting reports on Williams--and that's a HUGE concern. From the little I've seen of Williams, it looks like he has a quicker release, is more accurate, reads defenses better than Fields and makes anticipatory throws more frequently, but I need to do a lot more research before I feel comfortable with him as a solid QB prospect.


The season ended 3 months ago. What are you waiting for?

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:24 am 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Hussra wrote:
Warner breaking down C-Will. Williams sounds like Justin Fields all over again; holds the ball way too long and will end up taking a lot of sacks at the next level where you're not playing against 19 year-olds with north-of-five forty times:


Yeah, I made this point a couple months ago. The flaws that we all saw in Fields are also frequently cited in scouting reports on Williams--and that's a HUGE concern. From the little I've seen of Williams, it looks like he has a quicker release, is more accurate, reads defenses better than Fields and makes anticipatory throws more frequently, but I need to do a lot more research before I feel comfortable with him as a solid QB prospect.


This guy tried to tackle Williams' time to throw problem.

https://www.dabearsblog.com/2024/all-ki ... e-to-throw

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:38 am 
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Here's an example of Williams being Fields-like:

Image

Williams is staring right at the receiver running the hitch-inside and there's an opening to lead the receiver into, not even a difficult throw. aim between the 2 defenders and let your guy take it on the run; which Warner calls anticipation but I don't think that's even anticipating a receiver breaking in or back or anything next-level. That's just staring at an easy completion and backing out of it.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:40 am 
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Hussra wrote:
Here's an example of Williams being Fields-like:

Image

Williams is staring right at the receiver running the hitch-inside and there's an opening to lead the receiver into, not even a difficult throw. aim between the 2 defenders and let your guy take it on the run; which Warner calls anticipation but I don't think that's even anticipating a receiver breaking in or back or anything next-level. That's just staring at an easy completion and backing out of it.


So I think you're saying Fields' play in year three of his professional career resembled the play of a college sophomore. I agree - that's why his ass was traded and demoted.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:46 am 
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Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Jayden Daniels
https://youtu.be/2b-K-1_od0Y?si=8h9MuIKIqQI_5z7l

Warner says he's got a good arm but missed reads and throws. Is a little concerned about his accuracy, like he is with Maye. Likes that he pushes the ball down the field and makes second level throws.



If it were a choice of Fields or Daniels, I'd have stuck with Fields.


I completely agree with you. I would jump off of the Poles bandwagon if he drafted that kid. He appears to be more likely to bust than the other guys being considered as a top 4 QB.

I believe you are both going to be wrong.


I just believe he has the same issues Fields does, but he lacks the dynamic playmaking ability. I don't think straight line speed works for a QB in the NFL, especially when you are under 200 lbs.

I believe he is a much better passer than you consider him, we will see. I would not take him over your Guy but he is my 2nd option.


His career really took off when he started throwing to two first round picks

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:47 am 
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aren't those the Huskies @USC from November? Williams would've been 22 year old Junior, iirc. Hard to tell from Warner's 2004 quality game tape upload.

yeah, Fields wasn't the answer. Usually teams don't go right back to the same flawed well and double-down on the same mistakes:





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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 7:47 am 
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if caleb williams is a bust i will start watching granny porn

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 8:00 am 
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veganfan21 wrote:



at least he doesn't deny that C-Will takes a lot of sacks. If I understand what he's saying, Caleb Williams takes a lot of sacks because Caleb doesn't take easy, quick completions for a no-sweat 1st down. Instead, he backs out of those 1-2-release easy-peasy throws and runs around the backfield like Barry Sanders and then attempts a pass of greater difficulty until he either completes that or takes a sack:

Image


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 8:02 am 
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veganfan21 wrote:
So I think you're saying Fields' play in year three of his professional career resembled the play of a college sophomore. I agree - that's why his ass was traded and demoted.
Exactly. Williams is going to have to adjust to playing in the NFL. It will take some time. There is a reason that so many quarterbacks that end up elite struggle or are average as rookies.

If you only drafted quarterbacks with nothing to work on you'd never draft one.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 8:08 am 
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Fields first season regularly getting run-down from behind by 300+ pound d-linemen...different game.

Warner repeatedly notes he can't really evaluate Williams as a pocket-passer in that yt clip--Williams has so few in the pocket downfield attempts. It's either check-downs/screens/rpo's or if Williams goes downfield it's after running around the backfield for 5 seconds and Rex'ing it.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 9:20 am 
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he's essentially comparing him to Aaron rather than Patrick. And I'll take that.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 9:35 am 
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Tall Midget wrote:
Hussra wrote:
Warner breaking down C-Will. Williams sounds like Justin Fields all over again; holds the ball way too long and will end up taking a lot of sacks at the next level where you're not playing against 19 year-olds with north-of-five forty times:


Yeah, I made this point a couple months ago. The flaws that we all saw in Fields are also frequently cited in scouting reports on Williams--and that's a HUGE concern. From the little I've seen of Williams, it looks like he has a quicker release, is more accurate, reads defenses better than Fields and makes anticipatory throws more frequently, but I need to do a lot more research before I feel comfortable with him as a solid QB prospect.


TTT by itself is meaningless. I want to know if Williams TTT was high throwing down field or was it high completing short passes. If it was short passes then that is a problem.

Was he pressured during the long TTT or did he have a clean pocket?


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 9:36 am 
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Juiced wrote:
Tall Midget wrote:
Hussra wrote:
Warner breaking down C-Will. Williams sounds like Justin Fields all over again; holds the ball way too long and will end up taking a lot of sacks at the next level where you're not playing against 19 year-olds with north-of-five forty times:


Yeah, I made this point a couple months ago. The flaws that we all saw in Fields are also frequently cited in scouting reports on Williams--and that's a HUGE concern. From the little I've seen of Williams, it looks like he has a quicker release, is more accurate, reads defenses better than Fields and makes anticipatory throws more frequently, but I need to do a lot more research before I feel comfortable with him as a solid QB prospect.


TTT by itself is meaningless. I want to know if Williams TTT was high throwing down field or was it high completing short passes. If it was short passes then that is a problem.

Was he pressured during the long TTT or did he have a clean pocket?


Check the link out above.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 9:59 am 
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Williams throws a lot of short passes in that Warner breakdown.

Passes even where it looks like Williams could've run for a decent gain but throws it to a guy 7 yards away (sideways, along the line of scrimmage, not for a 7 yd gain) who is immediately tackled. It's not Williams best game; but then neither was that Utah game breakdown. So I dunno where the Williams good tape is at.

Kurt even mentioned having to dump a bunch of screen passes/check-downs from the video because there were so many.


Part of it is perspective: Warner isn't impressed by Williams skipping a read on an open receiver for a 7 to 10 yard gain early in the play to run around and make a hero ball throw downfield.


Last edited by Hussra on Wed Mar 20, 2024 11:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 10:24 am 
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 10:26 am 
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Caller Bob wrote:
Happy Pro Day!


It's a great time to be alive.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 12:24 pm 
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Interesting football philosophy question about getting sacked on 3rd down.



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 12:28 pm 
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Hussra wrote:
Williams throws a lot of short passes in that Warner breakdown.

Passes even where it looks like Williams could've run for a decent gain but throws it to a guy 7 yards away (sideways, along the line of scrimmage, not for a 7 yd gain) who is immediately tackled. It's not Williams best game; but then neither was that Utah game breakdown. So I dunno where the Williams good tape is at.

Kurt even mentioned having to dump a bunch of screen passes/check-downs from the video because there were so many.


Part of it is perspective: Warner isn't impressed by Williams skipping a read on an open receiver for a 7 to 10 yard gain early in the play to run around and make a hero ball throw downfield.



You do realize nobody reads the paragraphs of nonsense you post?


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 1:16 pm 
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KDdidit wrote:
Interesting football philosophy question about getting sacked on 3rd down.



"I think sacks are an overblown stat"

Sounds like a packers fan

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 1:24 pm 
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veganfan21 wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Jayden Daniels
https://youtu.be/2b-K-1_od0Y?si=8h9MuIKIqQI_5z7l

Warner says he's got a good arm but missed reads and throws. Is a little concerned about his accuracy, like he is with Maye. Likes that he pushes the ball down the field and makes second level throws.



If it were a choice of Fields or Daniels, I'd have stuck with Fields.


I completely agree with you. I would jump off of the Poles bandwagon if he drafted that kid. He appears to be more likely to bust than the other guys being considered as a top 4 QB.

I believe you are both going to be wrong.


If it's between Daniels and Fields I'm going with option C.



If they gave Bagent a fair chance, he might beat out vegan's hero.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 1:29 pm 
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The Hawk wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Hawg Ass wrote:
Nas wrote:
good dolphin wrote:
veganfan21 wrote:
Jayden Daniels
https://youtu.be/2b-K-1_od0Y?si=8h9MuIKIqQI_5z7l

Warner says he's got a good arm but missed reads and throws. Is a little concerned about his accuracy, like he is with Maye. Likes that he pushes the ball down the field and makes second level throws.



If it were a choice of Fields or Daniels, I'd have stuck with Fields.


I completely agree with you. I would jump off of the Poles bandwagon if he drafted that kid. He appears to be more likely to bust than the other guys being considered as a top 4 QB.

I believe you are both going to be wrong.


If it's between Daniels and Fields I'm going with option C.



If they gave Bagent a fair chance, he might beat out vegan's hero.


And if you have the blue pill a chance, you might get to three inches.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2024 1:39 pm 
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